View Full Version : the best block for X1950XT-X
Hodgstar
10-20-2006, 06:56 AM
I need a water block for the X1950XT-X i'm about to buy but I am unsure which one is the best. I will probably get the ATI Radeon X1950 XT-X*Crossfire/Master Edition* first http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/X1950_Series.html#aGX_2d050_2dco
(The one at the top of the page)
Then hopefully get a slave in the new year. So I need a block that I can convert to a crosfire setup at a later date.
The rest of the water cooling system is as follows.
Swiftech MCP655 12 VDC Pump
10" ThermoTube reservoir
Swiftech Storm Extreme Performance Universal Water-block
Thermaltake T-type Liquid Temperature Detector
1/2" Tygon R-3603 tubing.
Cost is not a problem I want the best performance as i want to overclock.
im using an EK full cover waterblock on my x1900 and sofar im very happy with the performance - and it can also do crossfire. ive got the sliders in the ati overdrive thing maxed out and it runs beautifully.
if it fits the x1950 then it would be a very good buy.
davidzo
10-20-2006, 08:00 AM
The best performing block today would probably be the GPU-X 1900 from watercool:
http://www.caseumbau.de/test425/g-013.jpg?PHPSESSID=6dda25b9bdf5cec5395be161a07ec1db
http://www.caseumbau.de/test425/g-009.jpg?PHPSESSID=6dda25b9bdf5cec5395be161a07ec1db
The GPU-X basepart is well constructed and should perform even better than the aquaextreme MP-1 single gpu chipcooler. So for performance this cooler is the first choice. It was tested in hardwareluyy magazine this year against some othe rofferings from alphacool, ek-waterblocks etc. and came out on top.
I think EK would be the second choice. the blocks are pretty cheap for what you get, well made and you can get them all over the world cause edvard könig sends to many countrys and many shops in europe and us already have them.
but i don't know if you can use them in C/F.
the dangerden blocks are quite similar to the EK ones, but ,ore expensive and a little less nice manufactured, but are crossfire capable and you can buy several addons for them.
alphacoolblocks seem to perform really good, but compared to ek and dd and even watercool blocks they are really high restrictive and kill a lot of flow that i don't want to recommend them.
I would go for the watercool ones until my cooler is finished they will be best :D
Its also allcopper, no acrylic sheet or sth that can easily crack or leak when you forget to plugin the pump. all copper solutions are the most solid ones.
topaimz
10-20-2006, 10:50 AM
hmmm, I was wondering about this too...
which waterblocks are compatible with the x1950xtx?
Are mcw60, maze, etc. compatible with it?
fhpchris
10-20-2006, 10:54 AM
Maze4 on mine, Even with 1.65v conroe gpu never gets over 42c load.
I have seen ATI tool say 30c idle! Usually ~37c idle at room temps.
topaimz
10-20-2006, 12:10 PM
Maze4 on mine, Even with 1.65v conroe gpu never gets over 42c load.
I have seen ATI tool say 30c idle! Usually ~37c idle at room temps.
Is the mounting holes same on x1950xtx with x1900?
If not, your telling me info that I don't need :p:
If so, thank you :D
Bad213Boy
10-20-2006, 01:40 PM
what would you say the best block for an ATI x850 Pro AGP is? would it be the Watercool HK 2.1 GPU-X X1800/1900?
JoeBar
10-20-2006, 02:24 PM
Is the mounting holes same on x1950xtx with x1900?
If not, your telling me info that I don't need :p:
If so, thank you :D
Mounting is the same.
Sparky
10-20-2006, 03:14 PM
what would you say the best block for an ATI x850 Pro AGP is? would it be the Watercool HK 2.1 GPU-X X1800/1900?
way to hijack :rolleyes: ;)
creidiki
10-20-2006, 03:23 PM
Mounting is the same.
But the GDDR BGAs might be a different height - this was the case on cards thta came in GDDR2 and GDDR3 versions, so it might also be the case with the GDDR4 on the X1950XTX.
Eddy would know for sure :)
Emmett
10-20-2006, 03:37 PM
I noticed that DD has x1950 compatibility listed for the Tyee blocks.
So maybe the new GDDR is same height as old.
Emmett
warriorpoet
10-20-2006, 03:44 PM
The EK blocks can be drilled specifically for Xfire.
topaimz
10-20-2006, 05:03 PM
The best performing block today would probably be the GPU-X 1900 from watercool:
http://www.caseumbau.de/test425/g-013.jpg?PHPSESSID=6dda25b9bdf5cec5395be161a07ec1db
Where the heck do they sell these?!
Everything is, I think, in German... no clue what i says :confused:
Additionally, I like the full copper make of this thing, but why is the
mounting hardware, which looks like it is applied to cool the memory
made in aluminum?
Back to the point, where can a guy who lives in Canada, get one of these,
and how bloody expensive are these...?
creidiki
10-20-2006, 05:07 PM
I dont see any alu... anyway, so long as its not in contact with water, alu is fine, GDDR makes feck-all heat anyway.
I like the way they did the memory and vreg cooling on the flowkiller, easy to change it out and keep the core block when you change cards
Borgod
10-20-2006, 06:37 PM
http://www.watercool.de/_cms/index.php?SESS_ID=4b168dcea0c09695bbf9aab2b4a772f3&s_id=3
The aluminium is just for the mounting.
I might have to try and get one of these bad boys.
link didnt work for me...
here is a pic tho: http://212.227.231.249/watercool/cms/shop_pics/10140%2Dalt.jpg
Jupiler
10-21-2006, 01:26 AM
The Watercool GPU-X rev. 2.5 costs around 65€ over here, which is 10€ cheaper than Eddie's EK block.
I don't know any stores in the US which sells those blocks, so it might be hard to find one over there.
Good alternative is the EK block.
I have 1 myself for over 6 months now and i'm very pleased with it.
It's a little more restrictive than the GPU-X, but less than the Alphacool model.
You can get it prepared for crossfire, so that won't be a problem.
Drop Eddie a mail or PM, and ask if he can ship it over to you.
spudnik
10-21-2006, 09:45 AM
Where the heck do they sell these?!
Everything is, I think, in German... no clue what i says :confused:
Additionally, I like the full copper make of this thing, but why is the
mounting hardware, which looks like it is applied to cool the memory
made in aluminum?
Back to the point, where can a guy who lives in Canada, get one of these,
and how bloody expensive are these...?
dude... I've been thinking the exact same thing! I want to go the German WC route, don't want to use Aqua-Computer blocks, but the Watercool website only states the shipping costs for European nations, but not North America!
(maybe we can persuade Petra to start stocking German watercooling components in his shop)
RVWinkle
10-21-2006, 10:55 AM
The GPU-X basepart is well constructed and should perform even better than the aquaextreme MP-1 single gpu chipcooler.
Why do you think it would perform better?
From what I've seen most GPU waterblocks perform very similarly and you won't really see a difference in overclocking between one or the other. The Maze 4 is probably the best since it looks to provide the least flow restriction.
The criteria for GPU blocks really should be which one do you think looks best for the lowest price.
creidiki
10-21-2006, 10:59 AM
link didnt work for me...
here is a pic tho: http://212.227.231.249/watercool/cms/shop_pics/10140%2Dalt.jpg
Meh, its not in contact with water, its not even remotely an issue.
Remember than extra cooling of any kind is techincally 100% unecessary for GDRR3/4... youve got copper connecting the block to the GDDR there, thats technically overkill.
I dare you to make a thin hold-down plate out of copper that doesnt bend like a hot waffle :)
Apart from the fact that since it contributes virtually nothing to cooling, making it copper would simply be a waste of money...
Jupiler
10-21-2006, 11:20 AM
Radical_53 tested these blocks a couple of months ago, and his results were posted in a german hardware magazine.
Best performing block :
1. Alphacool NVXP-3
2. Watercool GPU-X
3. EK 1900
Pro's and con's of each block :
Alphacool :
Pro's :
- excellent performance
- easy installation
Con's :
- very restrictive
Watercool GPU-X :
Pro's :
- excellent performance
- less restrictive block of them all
Con's :
- installation
EK 1900 :
Pro :
- very good performance
- a little more restrictive than the GPU-X but less than the NVXP-3
- possibility for crossfire setup.
Con's :
- installation is easy, but you have to be carefull not to overtighten the screws during installation, specially for the voltage regulators.
Garrett
10-21-2006, 11:49 AM
Meh, its not in contact with water, its not even remotely an issue.
Remember than extra cooling of any kind is techincally 100% unecessary for GDRR3/4... youve got copper connecting the block to the GDDR there, thats technically overkill.
I dare you to make a thin hold-down plate out of copper that doesnt bend like a hot waffle :)
Apart from the fact that since it contributes virtually nothing to cooling, making it copper would simply be a waste of money...
The part with the WATERCOOL print is made of stainless steel, right?
creidiki
10-21-2006, 12:50 PM
Steel, Alu, dont matter *shrug*
The only thing with the GPU-X is you have to mod the hex-head on most barbs, because the fittings on the block are so close together.
Jupiler
10-21-2006, 12:51 PM
According to the specs on Watercool's site, yes, it's stainless steel.
fhpchris
10-21-2006, 04:44 PM
I never ran ramsinks on my X1950XTX, and I benched with 2.25v on mems.
Running ramsinks with thermal pads defeats the whole purpose of running them at all...
davidzo
10-22-2006, 07:26 AM
definitely not. my rams on a X1800xl are burning when i overclock them. dunno, gddr4 could be better, but with no air on them they are definitely a little hot to the touch. there is a lot of a difference between a well ventilated situation and a case without any additional cooling fans besides the power supply.
Running ramsinks with thermal pads defeats the whole purpose of running them at all...
Bullsiht
thermal pads add a max of 0.5-1° on the rams, even if they are 1mm or 1.5mm thick. At least that is the case with Bergquist high quality Gap pads.
Its much riskier to mill the copper block on the gpu down that it fits on the rams without a pad. Different vendors of rams have slightly different packages and there are also toleranzes of more than +- 0.1mm through the soldering process. Its impossible to make good contact on the rams and the gpu on all cards and in worst case the ram contact is good but not the contact on the gpu.
believe me, thermal pads for the rams are the professional solution and they cool quite good even with thick pads of 1.5mm and up. we are not talking about cpus or chipsets here, this is a wholly different situation which has to be handeld differently. gap pads are the best to manage gaps and uneveness.
Steel, Alu, dont matter *shrug*
The only thing with the GPU-X is you have to mod the hex-head on most barbs, because the fittings on the block are so close together.
Alu could bent, ss doesn't bent and is a lot heavier. It looks better too in my opinion. Only people who don't deal with metal often can mistake alu for steel. i do agree that these pics are very small, but if you look precisely you can see the darker somewhat more blue color of the stainless steel which is definitely not aluminium.
About the barb issue:
http://www.cooling-store.de/gfx/shop/images/item131_1.jpg
I have special slim Barbs which you can use together with 7/16" Tubing. They are designed for watercooling and small blocks. We didn't include a outer hex for optical reasons and put it inside of the barb instead what makes it even easier to screw and looks a lot better in my opinion. The barbs have been cnc-drilled in 2002 and are pretty outdated now. if i had money i would make a new series for 1/2" and 7/16" tubing with a little increased ID.
I just read the Article in hardwareluxx magazine again:
- The Article is from radical53, the same person who also testet the thermochill rads in aprofessional manner against the other offerings. THis numbers are often quoted here at X'S.
- The GPU-X has only 6% pressure drop and is a whole lot better than anything else tested including the EK waterblock. Its performance is even better that the Zern PQ+ CPU block with x1900 mounting hardware, which is nearly on par with the nexxos XP. I think this is really the best performing solution with the lowest pressuredrop.
creidiki
10-22-2006, 09:02 AM
Yes, but the key fact here is that while CPUs start to choke @ about 70c, and GPUs at around ~110c, GDDR BGAs are fine up to 130c, and that's only because the solder melts at those temps.
Its pretty hard to send a ship with a 4-5W heat dump (GDDR3) to 130c.
GDDR4 uses quite a bit less power - that's really the main reason why GDDR4 was developed, to have Video Ram which runs at lower voltages than GDDR3 and thus helps save power; because @ 5W per 64Mb GDDR3 BGA, the power draw for 768/1024 memory configurations was starting to seriously impact on the card's power profile.
davidzo
11-07-2006, 06:33 AM
the power draw of the x1950xtx is the same as x1900xtxs. As the chip is clocked the same and r580+ is even more advanced manufacturing technology with no more transistors, the heat output of the GDDR4 modules must be the same or lower as the heatoutput of the GDDR3 modules of the x1900xtx.
Its right that GDDR4 has less power draw heat output per clock, but as this is very early GDDR4 and its much higher clocked than its GDDR3 Counterparts on x1900xt, the heat output is the same.
GDDR4 won't get burned at temps over 70°C but i hate those checkered heat artifarcts which start to come up at those temps and overclockability is a lot lower when not cooled properly. Since i want watercooling in its full flavour without adittional noise a fan pointing to the graphics card is no alternative.
Thyts why fullcover blocks make sense in ceratin situations apart from looking brutal and nice.
Can anyone post post some pics of the waterblock please.