View Full Version : New watercooling ?high temps?Storm?>Conroe
Hello and thanks in advance for any advice given.
I just set up a water cooling in my stacker 830.I am only cooling with water my cpu (conroe 6600retail with asus p5wdh deluxe)
I have clocked to 3.6 so far. I am getting worse temps than on my zalman 9500 which makes no sense.
I have 2 cpu water blocks (both tried)
swiftech storm load temps 63c
antartica asetek load temps 56c(Antarctica CPU01/AT block Asetek)
black ice pro single 120mm (sunon fan)
waterchill mag pump(1020 L/H)extreame
I picked up a kit (I know but I have 2 kids and wanted a quick set up)
but after only dropping a few degrees off aircooling I thought the block was hitting the caps around the cpu.I put on the storm which is a beter block and am getting worse temps?
Is the single rad what is going wrong here?
any help please?
pics in link
http://img351.imageshack.us/img351/1084/waterxy2.th.jpg (http://img351.imageshack.us/my.php?image=waterxy2.jpg)
UPDATE
Ok through the help of everyone (thanksyou) I have gained a fair amont of info which lead me to pull out my WaterChill Xtreme [12V] Integrated Pump and use a swiftech 355 pump. Doing so my temps went 2-3 degrees higher using the swiftech. Any ideas or is the waterchill pump better?I am now using the storm block.
thanks for any help again.
Man is this swiftech pump tiny!! And I am using the plextop with T line.
New pic with the swiftech pump below
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/6893/img1053og8.th.jpg (http://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img1053og8.jpg)
Xeon th MG Pony
08-31-2006, 04:47 PM
Need a higher pressure pump with the storm like the MCP350/355
http://www.ntcw.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=NTCW&Category_Code=STH2OPUMP < Here is a nice close shop they are a bit tuff to find but once you do.
They seem to over charge a bit you can get cheaper from the states even after all the Bs but if you don't want to wait for shipping they do the trick.
smids
08-31-2006, 04:51 PM
Yup, that pump is too weak for that kind of block and rad. Both are very restrictive I believe (well the Storm is, and I'm about 70% sure the rad is too).
diekaste
08-31-2006, 06:02 PM
I have a storm and an Iwaki wmd-20 with the 6600es OC to 3.070ghz and 1.306Vcpu I get 62C dual prime 32M. It Idles at 54C. I use an automotive heater core (9'X10'~) and 1/2 inch tubing. Theres a 250mm fan plus two 92mm fans on the outside of the core. I probably am going to have to build a proper louvre on the outside of the case as I have the HC bolted over the 250 with the 92's on the outside of the case.
I can buy these pumps used
which would you say is the best.
Eheim 1250 water pump. 120V
Swiftech MCP655
I thought the pump I had was decent.
its says it pumps 1020 L per hour?
ReD.SkY
08-31-2006, 07:10 PM
flow rate is useless... you should be looking at head pressure.
of those 2 pumps you listed, the MCP655 is better
Bloody_Sorcerer
08-31-2006, 07:15 PM
flow rate is useless by itself, as is head pressure. its the balanced combination of the two that is key ;)
well max head on my pumps is 8ft
the max on the 655 pump is 10 feet.
Is that what you mean my max flow?2 feet make that much difference?
Anyone have any idea what temps I should be seeing if I was seeing between 55c -60c with air cooling?
ReD.SkY
08-31-2006, 08:19 PM
flow rate is useless by itself, as is head pressure. its the balanced combination of the two that is key ;)
1000 GPM with 1' head = useless
1000' head with 1gpm flow = useless
500GPM with 500' head = amazing
but generally the only reason a pump sucks is because there isnt enough head pressure to go through the restrictive waterblocks like the Storm and MP-05.
Head is more important than flow in this situation. But keep in mind, flow shouldn't be too little either.
100GPH w/ 10ft head ~VS~ 500GPH w/ 20ft head.
Which will win in a watercooling situation? The 500GPH pump.
All the above numbers are theoretical and are not representing any specific pump.
septim
08-31-2006, 08:22 PM
consider a water hose with nozzle on it, if you have more water pressure or head, you'd get water farther than if you had half opened water valve.
then consider the Storm with its jets, if you give it weak water flow and head, you have weak turbulence or none, therefore almost no benifits...
where as you have a better pump with more head and flow, when the water reached the storm jets, it would produce more pressure, producing stronger turbulence which would mean a more effecient storm block...
My block did not come with a manual nor did I find anything useful on the website.
does the hose pushing from the pump go into the center or side 1/2 fitting.
??
make a differnence?
Yup like they all said.. Bigger-better pump,bigger-better rad (Less restriction).
That'll help alot....
ReD.SkY
08-31-2006, 09:00 PM
My block did not come with a manual nor did I find anything useful on the website.
does the hose pushing from the pump go into the center or side 1/2 fitting.
??
make a differnence?
it should go in to the middle
middle connectoer = water in
Water goes In the middle barb. It makes a big diffrence
Khaotic
08-31-2006, 09:13 PM
FLOW rate means pretty much just what it says - how much water/unit it will move in a given amount of time.
The head rate refers to how high the pump can move water up a column of given meida. I'm not sure on the "exact" accepted/standardized diameter of the media, but lets just say - a pipe which is 6 inches in diamater going straight up. With the Head preasure of 10ft then it will move the water 10 feet up that media. So, of a sort - it is a preassure.
A low head rate with a high flow rate pretty much means you would need a large diameter pipe with no restriction to maximize the flow. Otherwise, it goes from flow to ooze. A high head preassure at the same flow would mean you could get away with using more constrictive duct work.
Man I sure hope I got all that right. I'm still kind of 'new' to the whole water cooling thing, and it took a lot of people explaining things to me - and i'm sure they wanted to bungee jump off a low bridge when they were done. I appreciate EVERYONE's input.
So to help Ca1n out, I'll pose the question; what is the best pump to use with a STORM block.
I would say a DDC Alphacool Pro. It should have more than enough umgph to get water through the block and that radiator. Downside is-its price.
Ok I just put the flow running through the middle and dropped 9 degress(now dual prime 51).
Now its not going directly from the pum but its at the end of the loop being that the flow runs throught the rad then into the middle cpu. SHould I run it directly from the pump or now does this not matter. And is dual rad a waste with just cooling a cpu?
So a 655 would be a big advantage over the pump I have or is there another pump than the 655 that is better(I am in Canada so avaible aswell)
Like I said the 655 is easy for me to find locally.
my pump specs below
http://www.asetek.com/default.asp?showPage=main/page.asp¶m=sideid&myvalue=667&contentSection=2&menuID=508
and thanks for all the skilled input.
:)
ReD.SkY
08-31-2006, 10:55 PM
MCP355/DDC+ with a alphacool top
septim
09-01-2006, 03:07 AM
if you can't find that mcp355/ddc+ with plexitop, then you could settle for that 655...
run it from pump to center barb of storm to maximize head pressure then the side barb to the rad, rad to res or T-line, then back to pump...
dual rad is not a waste as it would present more square inch area to be cooled, also good for if you decide to add a single low restriction GPU block...
if $$$/space/modding is no object of concern, then go for the thermochill PA120.3 with the mcp355&Plexitop...
Xeon th MG Pony
09-01-2006, 03:20 AM
I gave you a link for a local shop in town there are a couple other shops but you have to hunt.
NewType is the easiest to deal with though.
I gave you a link for a local shop in town there are a couple other shops but you have to hunt.
NewType is the easiest to deal with though.
Yes and thanks for the local tip! :)
Why is the 355 better than the 655?higher flow pressure?is it me or does it have very little flow rate.
smids
09-01-2006, 08:04 AM
Yes and thanks for the local tip! :)
Why is the 355 better than the 655?higher flow pressure?is it me or does it have very little flow rate.
Massive head pressure - about double that of the 655. Wait till you see the size of it too, I was flabbergasted. It's smaller than an 80mm fan - more like the size of a 60mm fan. I kid you not. It's amazing. It has good flow also with the modded top, which brings about a very happy medium of excellent head pressure and flow good enough for our loops.
anyone have a link to this mod? part needed.plexi glass mod
I found a local shop that sells the 355 but it 3/8 so I need a few part for my 1/2.
And I was looking at the mcp350 not the 355 wich has 20ftmax head.
wow
Ordered this right now.THat is double what my pump has.
smids
09-01-2006, 08:38 AM
It's not a mod as such, simply unscrew the stock top and replace with the Alphacool Pro top. Use the top inlet and watch that pump fly :).
I cannot really recommend one place for you as I'm not sure on who ships where and I have no clue about Canadian stores.
cool just have to find a store now that ships it.Ncix is out of stock.
Can anyone give me a link to the Alphacool Pro top. I am on their website but cannot find it.
and anyone where the 355 is in stock.
smids
09-01-2006, 01:22 PM
http://www.jab-tech.com/Swiftech-MCP-355-12v-DC-Pump-pr-3510.html
http://www.jab-tech.com/Laing-DDC-Alphacool-attachment-13904-pr-3515.html
Might be a bit on the pricey side though...
How bad were your temps on air?
Conroe IHS are crap and do really need to be lapped to geta decent core contact as i have found on over 50 ES chips i've used and sold!
ReD.SkY
09-01-2006, 05:23 PM
some of the newest IHS's are flat.. like the week 27 e6600's
ok this is what I picked up
2 x 1/2" to 3/8" UV Reactive Leakproof Reducer
1 x Alphacool Laing DDC Clear Acrylic Water Tank Attachment (13905)
1 x Alphacool Laing DDC Clear Acrylic Top (13904)
1 x *** NEW *** Swiftech MCP355™ 12 VDC Pump (MCP355)
the rad I have is a single and am want to keep a single unless it is a must
the rad is.Black Ice Pro 120 mm Radiator with ½ inch push on fittings
Is this rad decent?
Anyways items were shipped from florida from a place called performace Pc
and will be here 3-5 days.
THanks for all the help and please feel free to help if you see any other changes needed.
my air temps were 60c @ 3.6 with 1.5volts.
JoeBar
09-03-2006, 11:52 AM
Don't and i mean Don't use the crappy water tank.
smids
09-03-2006, 12:08 PM
Don't and i mean Don't use the crappy water tank.
Lol! Yeah, it isn't really required and hinders the performance of the pump slightly. Save your money ;) :)
Xeon th MG Pony
09-03-2006, 12:25 PM
ok this is what I picked up
2 x 1/2" to 3/8" UV Reactive Leakproof Reducer
1 x Alphacool Laing DDC Clear Acrylic Water Tank Attachment (13905)
1 x Alphacool Laing DDC Clear Acrylic Top (13904)
1 x *** NEW *** Swiftech MCP355™ 12 VDC Pump (MCP355)
the rad I have is a single and am want to keep a single unless it is a must
the rad is.Black Ice Pro 120 mm Radiator with ½ inch push on fittings
Is this rad decent?
Anyways items were shipped from florida from a place called performace Pc
and will be here 3-5 days.
THanks for all the help and please feel free to help if you see any other changes needed.
my air temps were 60c @ 3.6 with 1.5volts.
lol No they will be there in about a week +- 3Days don't foget about the ebil customs, and make sure have about 30 bucks in cash or more, to cover duties. I orderd a good amount from Performance PCs
They had the order out with in the hour I had it ordered. I talked to the guy personally and its being claimed as 30$ and air cost me 30$ for shipping.
I trade a decent amount through anandtech and redflags.
Ok so do not use the water tank? Recommondations for a res?
thanks.
smids
09-03-2006, 04:38 PM
MCRES micro - or just use a T-line.
renolle
09-04-2006, 02:56 PM
Yes, DO NOT USE the Alphacool Laing DDC Clear Acrylic Water Tank Attachment. I just finished my setup and I actually could not bleed the loop with that tank attachment, so I sent it back and got a T-line setup instead. Works like a charm
Sorry but can someone show me a t-line setup.
thanks
smids
09-04-2006, 05:33 PM
Sorry but can someone show me a t-line setup.
thanks
http://www.wc101.com/guides/t-line/
septim
09-04-2006, 06:02 PM
with the T-Line its important to attach said T before a pump inlet so that your pump can always have water..
*also note that with a T-Line its also takes longer to bleed air from your loop...
cool!
VEry simple.
thanks alot.
lamfear
09-11-2006, 03:34 AM
Hello
ok well I gained 2-3 degree using the swiftech pump(355) over my WaterChill Xtreme [12V] Integrated Pump. I really thought it would have dropped at least.Any ideas?
sephiroth8748
09-14-2006, 07:58 PM
Are you using top inlet on your mcp355?
syne_24
09-14-2006, 08:44 PM
got a pic of your new loop setup? I'm not an expert on water cooling but from your first pic it looks like you mount the Storm on its side which IMO is not efficient. You got gravity pulling the water downward and probably not making a lot of contact in the upper part of the IHS.
Also I cant tell if your old pump outlet is the top or bottom. If it's the top then you got pressure coming in the wrong port on the Storm which is probably why you are getting horrible temp. If the outlet of the pump is the bottom then it should be okay, just flip the Storm around and maybe check on the mount. That's the only thing I can think of.
sephiroth8748
09-14-2006, 09:10 PM
got a pic of your new loop setup? I'm not an expert on water cooling but from your first pic it looks like you mount the Storm on its side which IMO is not efficient. You got gravity pulling the water downward and probably not making a lot of contact in the upper part of the IHS.
Also I cant tell if your old pump outlet is the top or bottom. If it's the top then you got pressure coming in the wrong port on the Storm which is probably why you are getting horrible temp. If the outlet of the pump is the bottom then it should be okay, just flip the Storm around and maybe check on the mount. That's the only thing I can think of.
QFT. I just noticed that. Inlet for the storm is supposed to be the middle barb.
I am using the top out of the 355. All I have done is changed pumps.
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/6893/img1053og8.th.jpg (http://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img1053og8.jpg)
syne_24
09-14-2006, 09:45 PM
The second pic looks better. How are the temps now? Did you check your mount if it's flush? All the springs on the bolt should be tighten down evenly.
well the thing is I have not changed the heatsink just the pump.After the weekend I am goint to check if my heatsink is tottaly flat or not.
Reflex1
09-14-2006, 11:31 PM
maybe its just a bad mount?
btw, wot case is that
case is a stacker 830.Would switching the rad to a dual rad make a difference?
and does it make any differnece having the 120mm fan on the rad pushing or pulling through the rad?Any anyone else cooling a conroe with a a simalar set up @3.6 getting 52 dual prime?
thanks.
grogthegreat
09-15-2006, 03:50 PM
Right now I am getting 57 degrees F on a E6600 @ 2.7GHz/1.4v with my heater core radiator, pumps w/ a 10.5' head and a good block ( forgot which one)
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/6893/img1053og8.th.jpg (http://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img1053og8.jpg)
nice gpu cooler, looks quiet. nice amd/ati combo lol
runs really quiet and very cool.
Its another extreme member (IvanAndreevich) that put that on.Local buddy