Review: Yonah Vs X2 4400+

[Cooper]

Chinese websource HKEPC (http://hkepc.com/hwdb/yonah-crossfire-1.htm) recently tested Yonah T2600 and made face-to-face comparison with AMD X2 4400+ and PentiumD 840XE. Synthetic and real-life benchmarks were used.

Synthetic performance
http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/3834/synthetic2lu.th.jpg (http://img49.imageshack.us/my.php?image=synthetic2lu.jpg)

3DMarks and gaming performance
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/5836/gaming1ut.th.jpg (http://img161.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gaming1ut.jpg)

Yonah@2.9GHz
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/2377/yonahoced9rg.th.jpg (http://img118.imageshack.us/my.php?image=yonahoced9rg.jpg)

Testbed included:
Intel Pentium M T2600 2.16G 2MB L2
Intel Pentium XE 840 3.2GHz 800MHz 2M L2 x 2
AMD Athlon 64 FX 4400+ 2.2GHz 1MB L2 x2
Gigabyte GA- G1975X (i975X + ICH7R)
AOpen i975Xa-YDG (i975X + ICH7R)
DFI CFX200 LP (Xpress 200 CF ED)
Corsair DDR2 667 CL 4-4-4-12 512MB x 2
Corsair DDR 400 CL 2.5-3-3-7 512MB x 2
Delta Server Power 520W
HIS Radeon X1900XT 512MB
HIS Radeon X1900XT CrossFire 512MB
ATi Graphics Driver Catalyst 6.4
Maxtor DiamondPlus 9 7200rpm 8MB Cache 120GB

[Bar81]

Not very impressive. Obviously when you factor in power draw the chip is something but in terms of raw performance it struggles at times to keep up with the A64

[ex2cib]

wow, large margins for the 4400 in 3d, and when the yonah did win, it was very close

[M.Beier]

Odd that yonah gets so poor 05 results, seen previews where it r0cked, think its due to sucky mem...

EDIT:
Odd HL2 result too

[FartBubblez]

wow.. ive always thought yonah was alot better than this.. in the earlier review yonah absolutely desecrated the x2's..

[RPGWiZaRD]

http://techreport.com/reviews/2006q2/core-duo/index.x?pg=1 check this one I posted in news section if u missed it. It has that T2600 vs a lot of cpus benchmarked. A lot more interesting.

In 3DMark05 in this review for example it got 9490 points with the setup used, just below FX57 but beat X2 3800+.

Made me laugh comparing Pentium Extreme Edition 965 to that T2600. :rofl:

This is an impressive chip for such low power consumption. Now I wonder what it could do with 3GHz+ instead of 2.16GHz. Conroe comparisions next plz. :D

[artissco]

If you want play PC games choose AMD, if you want run SPi choose Intel :D

[Cooper]

Now I wonder what it could do with 3GHz+ instead of 2.16GHz.

Check linky - there is chart with OCed Yonah

Made me laugh comparing Pentium Extreme Edition 965 to that T2600

Now that part surely makes me think of biased facts. 965 EE looses to X2 4800+ in almost every test which ain`t quite right.

[fhpchris]

Told you So!

A64 has always decimated yonah @ 3D. PI is another matter...

[lapdog]

Total rubish.:nono:

[Vapor]

Check again everybody....they used Crossfire. Both Intel systems just can't keep up with the actual ATi chipset in 3D for a reason.

Knock it down to single card and watch out.

[kl0012]

Another Yonah review:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=coreduo&page=1
Very impressive ecpecially when you keep in the mind Yonah's power consumption.

[fhpchris]

Check again everybody....they used Crossfire. Both Intel systems just can't keep up with the actual ATi chipset in 3D for a reason.

Knock it down to single card and watch out.

BZZT! Wrong.

The scores in the Conroe thread (2.4 ghz with 7900GTX) have been almost exactly duplicated with a dual core 2.4 ghz A64 and 7900gtx with the similar clocks. We are talking within 100 points.

Considering Crossfire holds alot of WRs now, in no way is the FX-60 going to be dethroned 3d, at least not untill the XE Conroe appears. Socket AM2 isnt a great speed increase, but it does have a positive 7%-10% effect, which is in full force in 3d applications. AM2 is just throwing salt in the wound, making this performance gap between the FX and Yonah even worse.

However, if you are doing an application that does not trash the L2 cache, Yonah is alot faster. The only realworld application I can think of is decrypting the windows SAM by using brute force, and simple crypto.

I enjoy the competition, and I feel that Yonah/Merom/Conroe really made PI outdated as a benchmark of real world system performance.

[Vapor]

Come again? Which part's wrong? All three statements I made are true and verifiable. Yonah isn't a 10% increase over X2 clock for clock, but it's an excellent choice becuase it'll take LN2 damn well. ;)

Just look at the 840 results. We know that a 4400+ doesn't beat up on an 840 like that in single card. We know that Intel, unless you really know what you're doing, will not do well in Crossfire (and simply won't do SLI, heh). The results for the 840 are too low because of the chipset. The same chipset was used for the Yonah. (1+1=....)

The Intel results are obnoxiously low everywhere but 03 (which is amazingly Intel-centric), just look at the results. I'm not even talking about Conroe here, I'm just saying that the test setup REALLY favors AMD because of the use of a Multi-GPU set up.

THAT SAID: there is something to note here for the AMD fanboys. Intel still doesn't do MGPU well ;)

[Sub zero]

Nice to see some 3d mark scores we all know the Yonah rocks in superpye

[hipro5]

Is it because - maybe - Yonah was run with 166MHz fsb and about 200+MHz Rams........?......... :nono:

[ZX7891]

funny they used the slow rd480 chipset not the rd580 thats a good 10% faster in CF

[Delirious]

Is it because - maybe - Yonah was run with 166MHz fsb and about 200+MHz Rams........?......... :nono:

Says they used "Corsair DDR2 667 CL 4-4-4-12 512MB x 2"

[hipro5]

Says they used "Corsair DDR2 667 CL 4-4-4-12 512MB x 2"

Yea but at what frequency exactly?.......The Ram may support 667 but in what frequency it was running?.....:)

[Delirious]

Yea but at what frequency exactly?.......The Ram may support 667 but in what frequency it was running?.....:)

http://hkepc.com/hwdb/yonah-crossfire/oc.jpg

[fhpchris]

Come again? Which part's wrong? All three statements I made are true and verifiable. Yonah isn't a 10% increase over X2 clock for clock, but it's an excellent choice becuase it'll take LN2 damn well. ;)

Just look at the 840 results. We know that a 4400+ doesn't beat up on an 840 like that in single card. We know that Intel, unless you really know what you're doing, will not do well in Crossfire (and simply won't do SLI, heh). The results for the 840 are too low because of the chipset. The same chipset was used for the Yonah. (1+1=....)

The Intel results are obnoxiously low everywhere but 03 (which is amazingly Intel-centric), just look at the results. I'm not even talking about Conroe here, I'm just saying that the test setup REALLY favors AMD because of the use of a Multi-GPU set up.

THAT SAID: there is something to note here for the AMD fanboys. Intel still doesn't do MGPU well ;)

Look, Take Andre's Results and compare them on the orb. This is SINGLE CARD. A 2.4 GHZ conroe (EG: faster than yonah ok? wider execution cores) Hardly kept up with a 2.4 ghz A64 (using Cas 3-4-4-8 and an Asus A8N SLI!) during SINGLE CARD benchmarks of 05.

Now, matter of fact, Yonah has been proven to be a bad dual core solution. Even in 32m Pi, having two instances adds something like 3 whole minutes to the completion time. Yonah isnt a bad solution -- it just isnt the fastest for real world stuff, or 3D.

If Conroe cannot keep up in 3d clock for clock,SINGLE CARD EVEN then yonah wont. Look @ The Hall Of Fame:

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/3969/untitled3ua.jpg

Where is Intel in this list again?

[Vapor]

Conroe is *not* the discussion here. Only one enthusiast has ever run on.! On top of that, it was on hardware that's not designed for it (the board namely--the BIOS was just to patch it to function)!

Intel is not in those lists for one very good reason: awful support of MGPU setups by the existing chipsets. SLI is out of the question and CF only runs at 90% efficiency (at best--also factor in it's not nearly as plug-and-play as it is on AMD and you get stock boxes running very slowly). To get to the Hall of Fame, you primarily need TWO very high clocked cards.



Okay, I'm done talking with you.....looking at your sig, it's useless to argue, so this is my final post regarding this topic...but below's for everyone else to read in case they need perspective on the scores at hand.


What is known is that, at stock speeds, an 840 is extremely similar (performancewise) to a 4400+. If you look at the 840 and Yonah scores (outside of 03), they're PITIFUL. The chipset's responsible (well, the people using it are actually--PcCI2iminal knows what he's doing and has impressive results on Yonah with CF).

The Yonah is thoroughly beating the 840.

This is the first Yonah board out.

I won't consider the power consumption of Yonah into my decisions (if you run CF of X19s, you don't care about power consumption), but these scores are amazing considering the state it's in--Yonah has lots of headroom when you consider LN2 can be used and that it is at such a low-power state (can be witnessed in the fact that it hits 2.93 on air, which is slightly below average for an FX60).

Yonah's a solid processor, and I'm confident that when the dust settles, it will be the single card (and likely CF when Hipro gets it) champion.

If you believe that Yonah is only 84% as fast as an X2 clock-for-clock in 05, then, well...wow. :shakes:

[nn_step]

Intel wins in PI, AMD wins in Games.. now which would you rather spend more time doing...
Running PI or blowing sh1t up?

[[cTx]Philosophy]

Intel wins in PI, AMD wins in Games.. now which would you rather spend more time doing...
Running PI or blowing sh1t up?
For once I agree with NN...
16 secs super pi would still own though :P

[fhpchris]

Conroe is *not* the discussion here. Only one enthusiast has ever run on.! On top of that, it was on hardware that's not designed for it (the board namely--the BIOS was just to patch it to function)!

Intel is not in those lists for one very good reason: awful support of MGPU setups by the existing chipsets. SLI is out of the question and CF only runs at 90% efficiency (at best--also factor in it's not nearly as plug-and-play as it is on AMD and you get stock boxes running very slowly). To get to the Hall of Fame, you primarily need TWO very high clocked cards.



Okay, I'm done talking with you.....looking at your sig, it's useless to argue, so this is my final post regarding this topic...but below's for everyone else to read in case they need perspective on the scores at hand.


What is known is that, at stock speeds, an 840 is extremely similar (performancewise) to a 4400+. If you look at the 840 and Yonah scores (outside of 03), they're PITIFUL. The chipset's responsible (well, the people using it are actually--PcCI2iminal knows what he's doing and has impressive results on Yonah with CF).

The Yonah is thoroughly beating the 840.

This is the first Yonah board out.

I won't consider the power consumption of Yonah into my decisions (if you run CF of X19s, you don't care about power consumption), but these scores are amazing considering the state it's in--Yonah has lots of headroom when you consider LN2 can be used and that it is at such a low-power state (can be witnessed in the fact that it hits 2.93 on air, which is slightly below average for an FX60).

Yonah's a solid processor, and I'm confident that when the dust settles, it will be the single card (and likely CF when Hipro gets it) champion.

If you believe that Yonah is only 84% as fast as an X2 clock-for-clock in 05, then, well...wow. :shakes:


It is OK, I will do another Compar-o-thon

System #1 - Dumo - 13,265 http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/4646/screenshot0494wi.jpg
XTX @ 690/800
3.2 ghz Yonah
411 4-3-2-8

System #2 Chinkgai - 12,900 http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1272579&postcount=86
XTX @ 695/873
2.9 ghz X2 A64

System #3 Metalman2785 S754! - 12,818
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1313565&postcount=220
XTX @725/820
3211 mhz S754 Newark!


Now the problem is that many people run 790/890 ish on stock XTXes on 3.2 ghz A64 dual cores which ~14k 05. I did not want to compare Dumo's score to another cpu that has higher video card clocks.

Suffice it to say 3.2 ghz Yonah is about 400 3dmarks ahead of S754:stick:

[nn_step]

Suffice it to say 3.2 ghz Yonah is about 400 3dmarks ahead of S754:stick:
very nice comparison. now here is one for you s939 scores about 5% better than a s754 @ the same clock speed.

[fhpchris]

very nice comparison. now here is one for you s939 scores about 5% better than a s754 @ the same clock speed.

Single S939 or Dual core?

[nn_step]

Single S939 or Dual core?
Single core s939 running at stock voltage on the exact same chipset using the same windows install and the same parts.

[eminatic]

I can't see how you can make judgements on a processor based on 3dmark. It's pretty amusing stuff. I just read the review on GamePC and the Yonah at 2.6 is around 10% faster than the FX-60 in gaming. We're talking REAL games.

All Vapor was trying to say is that they ran the AMD on an ATI board that obviously has better support for MGPU than the Intel board does hence obtaining the higher scores in a few of the benchmarks. It wasn't the 4400+ pulling the extra FPS, it was the chipset. Running a single card configuration would have tightened those scores up a great deal and made the comparison much more 'fair'.

Intel isn't losing in games at all with Yonah.

[VulgarHandle]

the point is, if you have to decide on best gaming pc, amd still holds the crown, PERIOD, the end

it may be true that conroe will take the crown from fx-60 939, but we still haven't gotten a decent look at am2, all we've seen is the 2nd revision engineering sample, which showed to be worse than 939, so obviously not what we're gonna see when retail hits, and same could be said for conroe(other than it took superpi to a new level w/ it's combined 4mb L2)

i don't care who takes teh crown, i'll buy whichever does, i just hope one of them uses intel's combined L2 and amd's much talked about 'reverse hyperthreading'

intel guys need to calm down, this is a good comparrison, using what's available on retail now

amd guys need to recognize that yonah is still immature, and will get better, where 939 really won't

[NightCrawler™]

I'm even more happy now with my 4400x2 :D

[nn_step]

amd guys need to recognize that yonah is still immature, and will get better, where 939 really won't
Although it is true that EOL products rarely ever get improvements but don't even think that AM2 performance wont steadily improve.

[VulgarHandle]

Although it is true that EOL products rarely ever get improvements but don't even think that AM2 performance wont steadily improve.


of course am2 performance will increase, but how long is the am2 socket gonna be around, aren't there plans out already showing it's replacement w/in a year of am2's release? seems to me that am2 is nothing more than a way to hold the crown for gaming, give users ddr2, so they can keep SOMETHING for when the next socket comes about. as it is now, going from 939 to am2, what can u keep, your powersupply and vid card? isn't pci-e2 gonna be out soon?(or will it be reverse engineered like agp/2x/4x/8x?).



EDIT:as i'm sure you can all see, i'm still on socket A, just upgrading parts as i see fit, and so far, neither intel nor amd has given me significant reason to completely build a new system, unless i want better benchmark scores

[nn_step]

of course am2 performance will increase, but how long is the am2 socket gonna be around, aren't there plans out already showing it's replacement w/in a year of am2's release? seems to me that am2 is nothing more than a way to hold the crown for gaming, give users ddr2, so they can keep SOMETHING for when the next socket comes about. as it is now, going from 939 to am2, what can u keep, your powersupply and vid card? isn't pci-e2 gonna be out soon?(or will it be reverse engineered like agp/2x/4x/8x?)
Yes PCIe-2 is going to be out shorty but it is backwards compatable with PCIe

[VulgarHandle]

lol @ reverse engineered, thank you for backwards compatible, much better term

well, good then, one less thing to think about

i know that this is xtremesystems, and alot here build to be the best, but MOST here use what those good people do, as a reference for what they need, and i am one of those, i do try to contribute where i can(which isn't much) i'm just trying to keep some common sense in these discussions, and trying to keep the flame wars from distorting hard numbers

[Absolute_0]

I've owned nothing but 2 dozen AMDs over the last 4 years and i still think Yonah is a superior design.

Yonah overclocks better too, and do i even need to bother adding that all AMD's best stuff (B1, B2, B3...) coldbug at +20c? :(

If AMD X2 and Yonah are roughly equivalent clock for clock, the winner is gonna be whichever can bench the furthest. And when all the FX60s coldbug and top out at 3.5 Ghz with low HTT, i don't think it will be hard to beat for a Yonah on LN2...

[DilTech]

The question isn't who benches best...

The question is, who's better running 24/7 365, that's all that matters to me.

[Absolute_0]

The question isn't who benches best...

The question is, who's better running 24/7 365, that's all that matters to me.

Well i'll agree with that, what i said applied to the 3dmark discussion.

But since this is Xtremesystems, whichever overclocks better is gonna get the cake. I've seen plenty of Yonah @ 3+ Ghz on air, not to mention people who run phase 24/7 are going to have more reason to buy a Yonah than an AMD dual core. With AMD dual core you'll get a coldbugged one that won't work at all on a single stage, or you'll get a CCBWE or LDHBE that probably won't do more than 3.15 Ghz 24/7 on SS. Yonah runs cooler, and has room for improvement because DDR2 dimms are getting better.

[nn_step]

Remember it isn't just clock speed it is what is done at that given clock speed.
Soon they will both be out and then we can finally find what they do best

[zakelwe]

Well Dothan has been kicking AMD's ass in 3dmark for the last few months so I doubt Yonah is lagging too much behind. The problem up to now with comparing 3dmark scores is that until recently Dothan \ Yonah have been handicapped by the none enthusiast desktop chipsets that they have been forced into which have been slow and not multi gpu. That will change with Conroe.

Regards

Andy

[Revv23]

875 isnt so slow... ;)

but yes i agree PCI-E chipsets suck

[andyisc00l]

Can't you use anandtech's review of yonah vs x2? ... http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2648&p=4 ...

[Dumo]

Tyrou is hot on the chase @ 3Ds orb with a lot more cpu power to go..:)

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1414159&postcount=1934