x1900xt(x) 1.1ns ram timing optimization

[POGE]

Since the new Rabit 2.0a came out, I can now edit my xtx timings by making a custom bios, or doing in in realtime mode. I dont know much about graphics card timings, but I was wondering what would be some safe(ish) timings I could try out? I want to tighten them, but I dont know what aspects I should tighten, and by how much. Here are the stock timings:

CAS latency (0x9) = 09 (decimal 9)
RAS to CAS RD delay (0x9) = 09 (decimal 9)
RAS to CAS WR delay (0x1E) = 1E (decimal 30)
Row Precharge time (0x1) = 01 (decimal 1)
Row activate to Row active CMD time (0xA) = 0A (decimal 10)
Read to Write Turnabout time (0xF) = 0F (decimal 15)
Memory Refresh Rate (0x1D) = 1D (decimal 29)
Refresh Row Cycle Time (0x1) = 01 (decimal 1)

The stock memory speed is 775 in 3D, but I can overclock it to 825 on stock timings, with my VF-700CU. All suggestions appreciated.

[IvanAndreevich]

Why don't you give it a try in realtime mode?

[einCe]

Why don't you give it a try in realtime mode?
because he doesnt know what to change, and doesnt want to potentially damage his card

[bazx]

Since the new Rabit 2.0a came out, I can now edit my xtx timings by making a custom bios, or doing in in realtime mode. I dont know much about graphics card timings, but I was wondering what would be some safe(ish) timings I could try out? I want to tighten them, but I dont know what aspects I should tighten, and by how much. Here are the stock timings:

CAS latency (0x9) = 09 (decimal 9)
RAS to CAS RD delay (0x9) = 09 (decimal 9)
RAS to CAS WR delay (0x1E) = 1E (decimal 30)
Row Precharge time (0x1) = 01 (decimal 1)
Row activate to Row active CMD time (0xA) = 0A (decimal 10)
Read to Write Turnabout time (0xF) = 0F (decimal 15)
Memory Refresh Rate (0x1D) = 1D (decimal 29)
Refresh Row Cycle Time (0x1) = 01 (decimal 1)

The stock memory speed is 775 in 3D, but I can overclock it to 825 on stock timings, with my VF-700CU. All suggestions appreciated.


go get the spec sheet for the card ram from samsung you will most likely
find the timing are tighter already

any how the speck sheet will give you a base line to begin

ps what is rabit?

[kiwi]

rabit is ati bios editor but I didn't notice how you can change timings realtime

Why not relax timings to allow higher clocks? I will try this myself

[bazx]

the ddr3 on 7900gtx has tighter timing than on samsungs spec sheet

but there is no timing editor for the nvidia cards as yet

[einCe]

ati tool wont let you change mem timings so he cant do it in realtime. i tried :(

[POGE]

Guys, RaBit 2.0a has a realtime settings, and X1K series support. :) You can download it off techPowerUp. I have already tried checking the samsung spec sheet, and it wasnt very helpful. Any other ideas?

[bazx]

can you post the timings from your card

here are the spec settings for gddr3

http://net7.info/1/7900/timings/gddr3.png

[POGE]

On my card:
cas = 9 (isnt in the spec sheet???)
trc = 1
trfc = 1
trcdr = 9
trcdw = 30
trp = 1
trrd = 10

I think this is right... I cant figure out some of them. All the information on timings I can get is listed on the first post. This is what I've pieced together.

Row activate to Row active CMD time = 10

^^ Thats the timing on my card but I cant seem to figure out where that fits in. :-\

[bazx]

i dont think you are being shown the correct timings of the card

here is what i get from ntimings on my 79gtx and we have the same memory chips

http://net7.info/1/7900/timings/samsung.JPG

[Diverge]

here is the timings for a XL, and an XT 256 - you can get an idea on how they bumped up the timings to achieve the higher clock speed (except refresh rate is a little faster 1.4ns vs 1.1ns i guess). I think I am gonna try the XT256 timings on my XL and see if i can get higher mem OC :)

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/707/xltimings9or.png (http://imageshack.us)http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/308/xt256timings2ui.png (http://imageshack.us)

edit: there are no timing differences between 1900XTand 1900XTX - so nothing to get an idea there with

[bazx]

now i understand you are not being given the timings as a decimal number

that can be edited like in ntimings

[uwackme]

Looks like Rbit is seeing/diddling register values in ATI GPU memory controller.

What those register values translate into as far as "XXns" versus the Samsung data sheet, we dont know. That would have to come from ATi engineering.

[ahmad]

This is what I got:

cl: 9

-----------RaBit----------Spec Sheet
Trcdr------ 9 clk---------- 12
Trcdw----- 30 clk--------- 8
Trp ------- 1 clk---------- 10
Trrd------- 10 clk--------- 8
Trtw ----- 15 clk--------- N/A
Trfc ------ 1 clk---------- 45

I have a feeling those timings aren't labelled correctly... I mean there is no way Trfc is 1. Its probably the 30..

[einCe]

someone needs to come up with some killer ram timings like the x850 ones

[Kesnel]

someone needs to come up with some killer ram timings like the x850 ones

Seconded! I'd be great if someone who's already got a nice bios with good timings could post it up.

[bazx]

Seconded! I'd be great if someone who's already got a nice bios with good timings could post it up.

would be nice but im sick of waiting we can do this here if we put our minds to it

[Diverge]

well so far i've found that by using the XT 256mb ram timing on my XL, I can get much higher memory overclocks, and get close to where i was at the tighter timings and more voltage on the memory. Since the rabit doesn't allow ram voltage changes (i hope yet), i'm trying to find where my card performs the best at the stock voltage (for the memory). I'm gonna try to lower my OC on the memory, and see if tightening them more then stock yields better scores.

[Turok]

So what benefits the r520 and r580 the most?
Looser timmings with higher bandwith or tighter timmings and slower bandwith?
What has been seen with other video cards when timmings are modified?

Run some benchmarks to make sure that changing the timmings doesnt affect stability or reduce performance.

[baracus2k]

would be nice but im sick of waiting we can do this here if we put our minds to it
take a look at some of the preoverclocked cards' bios like xfx xxx versions... grab it from http://www.mvktech.net/ ... leme kno if u find anythin.... ill look into this as soon as my 7900gtx arrives from evga (estimated wed)

[bazx]

take a look at some of the preoverclocked cards' bios like xfx xxx versions... grab it from http://www.mvktech.net/ ... leme kno if u find anythin.... ill look into this as soon as my 7900gtx arrives from evga (estimated wed)

been doing just that but nibitors wont show the timings unless it reads them from the card its self

and then only shows um in hex

[POGE]

When I get home tonight I'll work on some custom timings by just trial and error on my x1900xtx, I'll try to have some custom bios with optimised timings for download in a day or two.

[einCe]

So what benefits the r520 and r580 the most?
Looser timmings with higher bandwith or tighter timmings and slower bandwith?
What has been seen with other video cards when timmings are modified?

Run some benchmarks to make sure that changing the timmings doesnt affect stability or reduce performance.
r580's are bandwidth starved

[IvanAndreevich]

r580's are bandwidth starved
And timings? How about a link when you make a statement like that, or some numbers :confused:

[einCe]

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=95189
Opteron 170
ATI x1900XTX (all default settings, except AI on Standard and Midmap on Performance, not high performance).

Down to business, I decided to see how well the card scales with overclocking so I began some tests. I used 3DMark06 and more specifically Deep Freeze (DF), Fill Rate tests (FR), and Pixel Shader (PS). I figured these tests would pick out the slightest changes in performance as well as not be as CPU dependant (especially fill rate and pixel shader). So I ran it the first time:

DF ------------ 21.703 FPS
FR (Single) ---- 3946.89 MTS
FR (Multi) ----- 7969.995 MTS
PS ()---------- 229.809 FPS

Looking pretty good, lets see what it does at 681MHz/801MHz (vs 650/774 stock) - all at default voltage still here.

Core: 681MHz
Mem: 801MHz

DF ------------ 28.936 FPS
FR (Single) ---- 5261.205 MTS
FR (Multi) ----- 10979.391 MTS
PS ()---------- 307.039 FPS

Wow. I was amazed. How can I gain 77FPS in pixel shader just like that?! Everything went up enormously considering the measly clock frequency increase. What was my reaction? happy . Then I decided to push a little more:

Core: 702MHz (now voltage up +0.025v)
Mem: 801MHz

DF ------------ 29.175 FPS
FR (Single) ---- 5257.017 MTS
FR (Multi) ----- 11184.251 MTS
PS ()---------- 309.469 FPS

Now I can make some sense of the data. The increase in RAM speed really shows just how much bandwidth these cards demand (from stock -> first result). Everything still went up with the exception of Fillrate single texture,which to me indicates direct dependance on pure bandwidth, unlike the rest.

try not to be so agressive next time ;)

[POGE]

It would really speed up the process if someone made a post comparing samsung reference timings to 7900gtx and x1900xtx timings with their rated speeds.

[bazx]

thats what this is the timings from my bfg 700gtx 512

http://net7.info/1/7900/timings/samsung.JPG

[POGE]

Sorry - I missed that post. ;)

[bazx]

if you look the timings shown in ntimings ant far off the data sheet

and shows that the 79 timings are tighter then samsung surgest they be set at

[einCe]

xt bios

[baracus2k]

ya we need more people to contribute to this thread....... 7800GTX 512 timings can be helpful as its the same ram but they clock better in terms of ram

[Diverge]

just something to throw out there. If someone puts out a custom bios (voltages, timing, clk changes), and someone else decides they want to use it, they gotta be careful as not all cards hold the same overclocking potential. A good thing to do is load a custom bios into rabit and check off the realtime box for each tab, to insure it works correctly and has some room for stability. It's good to share what works for one another, but I think tinkering with it yourself is the best way to insure you end up with a bios that doesn't render your card useless ;)

has anyone that has been playing with timings in realtime mode noticed if they adjust a timing to something that yeilds worse performance, and they go back to the prior settings, that the performance is still bad? for some strange reason this happened to me a couple times - so it might be best to try a fresh reboot after timing changes. I dunno if it is a software bug, something with my system, but it's something i've noticed. Anyone else seeing this? (i've been doing all changes via rabit realtime mode w/o atitool running.)

[einCe]

just something to throw out there. If someone puts out a custom bios (voltages, timing, clk changes), and someone else decides they want to use it, they gotta be careful as not all cards hold the same overclocking potential. A good thing to do is load a custom bios into rabit and check off the realtime box for each tab, to insure it works correctly and has some room for stability. It's good to share what works for one another, but I think tinkering with it yourself is the best way to insure you end up with a bios that doesn't render your card useless ;)

has anyone that has been playing with timings in realtime mode noticed if they adjust a timing to something that yeilds worse performance, and they go back to the prior settings, that the performance is still bad? for some strange reason this happened to me a couple times - so it might be best to try a fresh reboot after timing changes. I dunno if it is a software bug, something with my system, but it's something i've noticed. Anyone else seeing this? (i've been doing all changes via rabit realtime mode w/o atitool running.)

i'd be the guinea pig, but there are 2 problems.

1: rabit wont let me do anything but see what my timings are.
2: i dont know what to change in what order and how far.

someone clear this up and ill do it

[Eastcoasthandle]

you have to go to Logging tab then scroll down and you will find the timing information
tCL=09
tRccdRD=09
tRccdWR=18
tRP=08
tRRD=08
tR2W=0C
MemRR=1D
tRFC=20

[einCe]

uh..yeah i know how to identify the timings i want to CHANGE them

[Eastcoasthandle]

uh..yeah i know how to identify the timings i want to CHANGE them
Not going to happen Captain, it's buggy. I just found out. It doesn't recognize the x1900xtx and I get errors using it.

[LexDiamonds]

The best solution to this mess is going to be a version of ATI tool that works as well for the x1900s as it did for the x800 series.

-No BS overclocking
-Mem timing adjustment
-Voltage control
-temp monitoring

I hope wizzard is close to something because I have not seen anything working particularily well and I really dont want to be stuck at 690/800.

I know this is "master of teh obvious" but until we have an app that can accurately read and adjust mem timings its not worth speculating as to what has what effect.

[licken]

you have to go to Logging tab then scroll down and you will find the timing information
tCL=09
tRccdRD=09
tRccdWR=18
tRP=08
tRRD=08
tR2W=0C
MemRR=1D
tRFC=20

Got same as you but my MemRR is set to 06. :S
Much lower than yours and all others. :woot:
And still i can go 900 rock solid with just 2,217v on mem. :cool:

[POGE]

Well I fried my motherboard, so this is up to you guys, best of luck.

[einCe]

can someone get a hold of wizzard by email or somethin and ask him if hes planning to add support for it or if hes even figured it out yet?

[IvanAndreevich]

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=95189


try not to be so agressive next time ;)
You can't predict any possible effect of timings from that test in any way. I.e. no idea if timings are important for these cards or not.

[POGE]

I'm a friend of w1zzard, and he says that memory timings for the X1K series wont be availiable any time soon.

[kiwi]

Well I fried my motherboard, so this is up to you guys, best of luck.

By changing timings using Rabit? What exactly happened?

[POGE]

By changing timings using Rabit? What exactly happened?
Nah, I just dropped my rig trying to move it. :rolleyes: Busted a cap off the mobo, didnt notice it, then tried to boot up. :(

[POGE]

Bumpity. I should be getting a new motherboard on monday. :)

[rob2687]

-- Active memory timings --
tCL = 09
tRcdRD = 09
tRcdWR = 18
tRP = 08
tRRD = 08
tR2W = 0C
MemRR = 1D
tRFC = 20

Mine is a Powercolor x1900xtx.

[ahmad]

Got same as you but my MemRR is set to 06. :S
Much lower than yours and all others. :woot:
And still i can go 900 rock solid with just 2,217v on mem. :cool:

Come again? Whats your video card, brand, and RAM please?

[POGE]

*bump*

[Ket]

the ddr3 on 7900gtx has tighter timing than on samsungs spec sheet

but there is no timing editor for the nvidia cards as yet

yes there is. nibitor.

[POGE]

Rabit 2.1 was just released and all the memory timings in 2.0a were wrong. Get the new one.

[danstar25]

HIS X1900XTX, using Rabit 2.1

CL = 11
RCDR = 10
RCDW = 6
RP = 9
RRD = 9
R2W = 13
RR = 2F
RFC = 20

[POGE]

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=103492

Done.