Best client distribution

[illmatik]

It seems like bandwidth and latency are the horsepower in the dimes world rather than cpu strength. I have 2 different broadband connections @ home. A 7meg down ~1mbit up cable connection and a 3meg down/768kup dsl line, and also have a neighbor's cable modem that he lets me use whenever I need some extra bandwidth. Do any of you know of a good traffic analyzer I can use to see which line I should stick my next agent on as I rebuild my home network, or does it not really matter? I have noticed my gf's P3-700 laptop running on 802.11b wireless card is putting up considerably less measurements than my p4 3.0 on the same network and it's ip is tagged high priority.

[[XC]thewildblue]

Hmm strange on the wireless and measurements. Im currently just using 2 lines, a 2mb/256k and a 512k/256.

I dont even think its down to latency or bandwidth, just sheer number of clients, as they all do a measurement at set intervals. Obvisouly if you were to have too many clients then bandwidth may become an issue.

[illmatik]

Oh cool. So I guess I can load more on to my dsl line which is my secondary line. The gf just uses the wireless on it to be able to surf from the laptop.

[Mr_Slinky]

Oh cool. So I guess I can load more on to my dsl line which is my secondary line. The gf just uses the wireless on it to be able to surf from the laptop.

i dont think you can have more then 1 instance running per machiene even if its got ht/dual core since its by connection and not cpu.

[[XC]thewildblue]

No your right you cant have more than 1 instance running per OS regardless of number of CPUs.

[illmatik]

Yeah, I was talking about clients as single physical machines and instances and how to distribute the load each dimes agent uses between 2 different switches on 2 different wans.

[Entity_Razer]

If you happen to have a rig which is capable of VMware ,install different OS's/virtuals and run them (Besides your MAIN os I'd run 2 more on a DECENT CPU, on a good one 3 or 4 more
depends on RAM actually

Ask TWB for more info on what comp can handle how many virtual machines

[[XC]thewildblue]

You would be surprised what a PIII450 and 256mb of ram can do.....hehe

[[XC] moddolicous]

You would be surprised what a PIII450 and 256mb of ram can do.....hehe
What about a p2 & 24mb ram?????

[Helheim]

Is VMware better than Virtual PC?

[[XC]thewildblue]

I prefer VMware of virtual PC, but I havent really played with virtual for a long time.
Vmware is better with linux than virt PC.

A p2 with 24mb is good for just one client, try and dig out some more ram for that bugger !

[Entity_Razer]

RAM is life for a virtual setup.

Not so much mhz because I don't think your gonna work on it with like 3 diffferent OS's on a virtual machine so...

256MB ram minimum I reckon

[[XC]thewildblue]

Yeah 256 will run 3 setups but very slowly. Thats windows 2000, I couldnt get NT4 to work properly.

[Helheim]

How much RAM do you associate with each one? Does 2000 take less ram than XP? With XP I've been giving each one 128MB.

[[XC]thewildblue]

Im really tight on RAM allocation, when the host only has 256mb I assign each VM about 32mb. If I have more then they get 64mb. The best way to do it in my view is do an install with as much ram as poss. Then patch and get ready. Change swap file size early (I only give each vm a gig of drive space). Then make copies of this VM and start up each one separately, create a new ID for each and change PC name. Then once you have the required amount ready, change the Ram down to the minimum and power em all up. If you do each one in turn with new install etc it takes ages.

The quickest way to also install is to use an ISO image instead of a cdrom. So get your original CD and create an ISO from it. Then you can also install over your network if you like saving the need to get up and put a cd in a remote machine.

Hope that helps.

[InSanCen]

Im really tight on RAM allocation, when the host only has 256mb I assign each VM about 32mb. If I have more then they get 64mb. The best way to do it in my view is do an install with as much ram as poss. Then patch and get ready. Change swap file size early (I only give each vm a gig of drive space). Then make copies of this VM and start up each one separately, create a new ID for each and change PC name. Then once you have the required amount ready, change the Ram down to the minimum and power em all up. If you do each one in turn with new install etc it takes ages.

The quickest way to also install is to use an ISO image instead of a cdrom. So get your original CD and create an ISO from it. Then you can also install over your network if you like saving the need to get up and put a cd in a remote machine.

Hope that helps.

Fancy doing a walk-through on that? I've never used VMWare, but have a friend who will donate me his Disc(s?), (They're Legit), as he no longer uses it.

I guess a dedicated DIMES box with XP2400, 512MB DDR & 20Gig would be okay soley for this purpose?

[IFMU]

TWB, may I suggest you do a little write up with details on how to do all this you are talking about?
I have 2 duallies here that both have 512memory that I can setup but to be honest, you pretty much lost me on most of what you said.
Cough up some details and explain how to do all this your asking to be done!

[[XC]thewildblue]

No problem once I get home from work tonight I will get started on it.

[IFMU]

Very cool!
Many thanks for your time!!!

[[XC]thewildblue]

Here is a quick guide on getting started.

Thewildblues VMware Quickstart Guide


Once you have installed VMware, start up the program and you will be presented with the following screen. From Here select create new Virtual machine.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37341
Now select typical
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37342&stc=1



Now choose you operating system of choice. Lets go with 2000 pro for the moment.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37343&stc=1

We now choose the name and location for our VMware OS.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37344&stc=1

You are now presented with your networking choice. For standard use I always use bridged.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37345&stc=1

[[XC]thewildblue]

You are now asked to specify the size to allocate. I choose 1gb as Im a tight arse. Ive never bothered with allocate now as Im too impatient to wait. It is tight on 1gb though.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37346&stc=1



Hey presto you nearly ready to go. Now double click memory to specify the amount for your virtual machine. When installing an OS I usually give as much as possible as it takes less time.
Once the machine is all installed you can tune it from there.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37347&stc=1



Its as easy as this to allocate memory, just move the slider or enter the number.

I have found that I can run as low as 32mb for windows 2000.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37348&stc=1

Next double click CDROM. This is where you can choose you device of choice (if you have more than one drive) or instead choose an ISO image to install from. Once done click ok.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37349&stc=1


You are now ready to power up your virtual machine. Install your OS as per normal.

Once you click inside your virtual machine you are locked in there. To release the cursor press ctrl and alt together. Once you have installed your OS you can then install VMtools from the VM menu, install VMtools.

VMtools allows you to move around without the need to press ctrl alt to release the cursor.

To enter ctrl alt delete to log in you now use ctrl alt insert to login to a virtual machine.

Once you have created you VM machine go to the folder and copy all the files to a new folder.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=37350&stc=1

Now start up this V machine and you are prompted if you want to create a new ID, select yes and also remember to rename the network name and IP address so it wont conflict with your previous machine. Once this has been done you can power up the original. You can repeat this as much as your machine can handle.

One thing to remember if you have specified a low disk space allocation, remember to adjust the swap file size accordingly as otherwise it will exceed disk space pretty quick due to having a swap file for say 256mb of ram. Also feel free to turn off as many unneccessay services as possible.

I wouldn’t install Dimes until the last moment on each as otherwise you will have say 3 machines with all the same Dimes ID, which I don’t thinks helps the points. Remember each dimes client will consume more bandwidth.

VMware can do quite a lot more from what I understand but Im not completely familiar with it as yet.

Hope this all Helps

James

[IFMU]

Is this the freeware version?
I might give this a shot once I get a few minutes free.
Thanks for the how-to.

[[XC]thewildblue]

No this would be the eval/full version. I am going to look for a shareware equiv though.

[Helheim]

What version of Java do you use, or which one takes the least amount of RAM?

[illmatik]

Ram usage is dictated by the -Xmx/-Xms parameters passed to the JVM at application startup

[[XC]thewildblue]

I always just install the standard client.

[IFMU]

Any luck on finding a freeware version for this? I cant even tell the bandwidth being used and could use 1 or 2 more but I need one of these I can use to do so.

[[XC]thewildblue]

No luck as yet. But I have had another idea. AS far as Im aware there are Linux OSes out there that have their own Virtual machine of sorts built in to the OS (the name eludes me at the moment). If this is the case then systems could be setup without the need to worry about licences etc.

Has anyone had anyluck running a linux client at all ?

[Ugly n Grey]

Try setting up a windows XP install with fast user switching enabled and just add users with a client running on each ?

so leaver user1 logged in and running, switch to user2 etc..

[heater918]

[QUOTE=Ugly n Grey]Try setting up a windows XP install with fast user switching enabled and just add users with a client running on each ?

so leaver user1 logged in and running, switch to user2 etc..[/QUOTE

This works? I can even do that. :cool:

[[XC]thewildblue]

Try setting up a windows XP install with fast user switching enabled and just add users with a client running on each ?

so leaver user1 logged in and running, switch to user2 etc..


Might be worth a try. I have tried terminal services and that didnt work.

[Ugly n Grey]

user switching is the same technology, it's unlikely to work as well then.

Did you put the terminal services in install mode and create a separate directory for each instance? As well you need to follow Suns directions for installing Java on a terminal server,

Because any attempt by java to share the same temps will give you errors.....

[[XC]thewildblue]

No I didnt go that far to be honest with the java. I did run in install mode and tried different directories though.

This was with Windows 2000 and not 2003 though.

[[XC] moddolicous]

Can u give a download link? I think we install the workstation version, right?

[[XC] DragonOrta]

with an XP pro VM, how do I get it the VM to have internet access. I've been trying to figure it out, but I can't.

[[XC]thewildblue]

Use bridged networking in Vmware. Then it should have an IP address on your local network. If not set it up manually and you should be fine.

[[XC] DragonOrta]

I set it up as a bridged connection, and it has it's own IP address, but it can't connect to the internet.

[InSanCen]

I used NAT, and it seems to work just fine...

[Cossey]

i used nat too, it causes slightly higher overheads but its not that bad even with 8 vms

[Mr_Slinky]

TWB what version of VMware are you using in those SS i gotta know

[[XC]thewildblue]

Version 5.0 Vmware Workstation.

[[XC] DragonOrta]

Ok, VMs just aren't working for me. I had three of them working last night, and this morning, none of them can connect to the internet. I guess I'll just have to settle for my three or so computers just using one client each. Grrr

[[XC]thewildblue]

Out of interest have u tried changing them from bridged to NAT, or vice versa and manually set the IP. This can be done quite easily once the VM is powered off.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39557

[[XC] DragonOrta]

How would I know what IP to set it to?

[[XC]thewildblue]

Do you know your internal range ? Do you have a router ?

Set the connection to bridged if you have a router, and make the default gateway and DNS the router IP. Then just assign a static ip in that particular range.
IF your using a modem try using NAT and then using DHCP and Vmware should sort it.

Lets start here and go from there, we will crack this VM issue !

[[XC] moddolicous]

Well, I think I might be getting it set up correctly. We will find out shortly.

[Highland3r]

How much of a performance hit you reckon I'd get switching from 2VM's running 256mb to 4VM's running 128mb? In theory the only difference is the amount of ram used, so the host machine wouldnt hurt. Would XP be able to cope ok running only 128mb of ram though? Would dimes itself suffer?

[[XC]thewildblue]

You would have more disk swapping, but I dont think that Dimes would suffer. XP will run, but disbale as many services as you can.

[Highland3r]

4 cloned VM's up and running (well 2 are, just installing dimes on the other 2 now) so fingers crossed production should increase without hurting either this net connection or the host pc :D

[Helheim]

4 cloned VM's up and running (well 2 are, just installing dimes on the other 2 now) so fingers crossed production should increase without hurting either this net connection or the host pc :D

Great, now I have to add some more.. ;)

[Highland3r]

Its only a net gain of 1VM :( Adding 4 was too much for a gig of ram to cope with, 4VM's @ 180 ish MB each, + all the associated servies etc.
Not given a huge boost, but a boost all the same :D

Might add another to this machine if you're adding more though ;)

[[XC] moddolicous]

Do u have a tweaked version of XP?? If u do, then u might be able to use 4. I gave my vm on one comp 64mb ram, and I think right now it uses only ~50mb or so.

[Highland3r]

Hrm could probably hack it down a bit...
6 agents on the 1 connection is ~ the max I'm willing to run tbh, might try and squeeze another on this machine maybe.
Gonna get a VM setup on the machine at home, which gives 2 clients on that machine, trying to get another setup on a mates pc too...
Its a pain the connection is shared tbh, otherwise I'd have loads more cilents running

[[XC] moddolicous]

Use nlite. Download it from nliteos.com. U can get rid of windows components u dont need (ie paint, drivers u dont need, and alot of other stuff) and disable any services u dont need. It works great. Both of my VM's only use ~700mb hard drive space and ~ 50mb's of ram. Works great.

[Highland3r]

Hrm nice :D Will have a play and get another OS installed on this machine
Cheers dude :D

[EvlUndrWareNome]

Fedora core 7 has a nice built in featureset for running VM's