Fridge, will it start up?

[X-tremist]

Thermostat Help
Previous problem resolved, I need help with wiring now :confused:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?postid=509263#post509263

Thanks everyone you has helped me so far.

Previous Post
I'm going to start a direct die unit with chilly1's help.


I found this fridge off the streets today. The owner had removed the door. I brought it home, plugged it in, nothing. I only kept it on for 3 minutes maximum. Generally how long should it take a compressor to fire up and start working (assuming that the fridge works).
The fridge was transported sideways, is that bad?

My observations after turning the fridge on for ~3 minutes:
-Heard a small humming noise (definitley not the compressor).
-Compressor was not making any noise
-Compressor was not producing any vibratio

[HawainPanda]

hm, i really don't think the compressor works just by that, the huming is prob from the fans of the condenser and evap, so i guess u have to do wat pc ice said

or u can use a pen electricity detector(i dunno wat its really called, but its a pen like thingy, that beeps if it detects a current) lol, this maybe quicker, but if u don't have one :P(they're like 99 cents)

[kayl]

friges dont have fans normally on the condensors
when the frige is on place your hand on the compressor and feel to see if its opeatting, it should vibrate and be a tad warm
also if you just got the fridge home you need to let it sit for a few hours to let the oil settle other wise it wont cool.

[TheJackal]

just a thought, most fridges and freezers won't power the compressor unless the door is closed, so check for a switch activated by the door

[chilly1]

As pc-ice said cut the compressor electrical and wire it in direct.

[X-tremist]

I drained the oil out of the compressor, I guess I should not have done that, but it is too late know.
I couldn't find anything on the net about the compressor, but it looks similar to Kayl's one.
Matsus*ita Electric FN11OQ22G (CCL2F2).
*=H

To remove the gas, there was a pipe with a vavle one it, similar to the ones you use to pump air into your cars tires. This is the same pipe I used to remove the oil.

My question is have I removed all the oil? I'm thinking of using propane, can this compressor handle it?
When re-oiling the system what pipe do I use? (I can't use the one I removed the oil with because it has a valve type thingo.)


Thankyou

[X-tremist]

Below are pics showing how much oil I took out, pics of the compressor and the pipe/valve that I used to remove the oil.

The oil in the container is 52cm^3
So the oil is 3cm in height and 11cm wide.
(1.2" Heigh and 4.3" wide).
Oil (http://members.optusnet.com.au/nanayakkara61/Imagestore/oil.jpg)
Valve-Cap Off (http://members.optusnet.com.au/nanayakkara61/Imagestore/compressorr%20003.jpg)
Valve-Cap on (http://members.optusnet.com.au/nanayakkara61/Imagestore/compressorr%20002.jpg)
Compressor-1 (http://members.optusnet.com.au/nanayakkara61/Imagestore/compressorr%20001.jpg)
Condensor-2 (http://members.optusnet.com.au/nanayakkara61/Imagestore/compressor2.jpg)

[JSU]

Ok im assuming that you are going to POE oil so you are going to flush the system with regualar ester oil then fill with poe, you should only put back as much as you took out. Then try runnning the compressor i guess.

[X-tremist]

Hi,

I'm going to be using Propane most likley, so it will be mineral oil. I removed the old oil using the valve type thing, where do i put the new oil in?

What is the oil that is in there right now?
Thanks.

[JSU]

where you took it out from, the valve type thing is called a schrader valve, its on the service pport so the person who put it there did you a little favor :) . Um why did you tak the oil out in the first place btw? it was a closed system and if the oil doesnt look abnormal.

[X-tremist]

Yes, taking the oil out was very stupid. I thought you had to do it. So is there any special tool to use to get the new oil in throught that valve?

If I put in mineral oil and lets assume that there is some old oil left behind, is it alright if they mix? I belive it will be okay as propane can be used with any oil.

JSU thankyou heaps, you got rid of a lot of my worries!!!!!!

[JSU]

its ok to mix them, you use a funal... you can tak out the core of that valve by unscrewing it. I think youle need a realy small plyers. The caps usualy have a little tool for taking them out.

[Redwolf]

Yumm.. brown oil. I can smell it from here.
What does the oil smell like... burnt and putred?

Didn't see where you posted the compressor started up

Looks to me like someone is in to much of a hurry... maybe you should think about doing so research on Refrigeration.

[chilly1]

That oil looks like peanut oil! It is a good thing you decided to change it, did you see if the compressor runs? Do that first. Don't worry about no oil in the compressor to test it. Test run it before you bother proceeding further. If you are using propane mineral oil will work fine. The color of the oil should be clear tinged very slightly not yellow. If you have polyolester oil do the rinse and perete oil flush. fill with the same amount you took out and roll the compressor around remove that oil and measure it and repete one one more time filling it with the amount you took out the last time. The trick is not to add more than you took out. To add the oil a hand pump works best.

[JSU]

o and make sure none of the ports are pointing anything important when you turn it on, I got a nice shot of oil in the face the other day. (was froma new compressor when I took out the rubber plug but it can happen out of the discharge)

read these http://www.vr-zone.com/?i=713&s=1
http://www.vr-zone.com/?i=714&s=1
http://www.vr-zone.com/?i=618&s=1
http://wwww.vr-zone.com/?i=230&s=1
http://phase-change.com/index.php?a...es&id=21&page=1
http://phase-change.com/index.php?a...es&id=23&page=1
http://phase-change.com/index.php?a...es&id=25&page=1

[kayl]

yeah that compressor does look similar to mine.
mines model though FN73Q13G
take that black cap off the side of the compressor and take a pic
there are two wires in there that you join together and this will make the compressor run when eva ya plug it in.
i use a springe without the needle to shoot the oil into the suction line.
i got mine from an ink shop, also you need a valve removal tool to get the valve out of the schaeder vale, sometimes when you buy schaeder vales they come as the cap

[X-tremist]

I confess I was in a rush, the weekend is the only time I have free.

The compressor is working fine, I just left the fridge plugged in for a while and it fired up. I felt the compressor, and it was quite warm and producing some vibration.

Thankyou all of you for your help!!!!
I will post a pic of the wiring in a matter of minutes.

Just a question, I tried searching this on the net but found no answer when the compressor is shaked or moved, something wobbles inside, is that normal?

Thankyou

[chilly1]

. Yes the compressors internals are mounted on springs to reduce vibration transmitted to the outside. So when we move it around you hear a noise, Danfoss compressors have weak springs so we get more movement but less noise a trade off, unfortunately for danfoss it also causes damage to improperly piped condensers Like the prommies. The excessive travel caused by the internals of the compressors causes inertia that is released when the box is moved in the opposite direction and then the compressor hits the side of the case causing a dent, this is common on all these even the vapochill. Luckily the vapo has a better condenser and I haven't seen damage to teh refrigerant circuit that we all saw on teh machI

[X-tremist]

EDIT-So in total there are three wires that go to either the thermostat or the fan, one blue, one white and one brown. So one must be the fan, the other two I must join up, now it is a question of which two wires?
I removed the annoying images as well.

I tried to be as accurate as possible with the diagrams and photos. When I say a wire heads off to the fridge that means it goes to the thermostat or the fan (you will see what I mean)
There are
2xBlue wires (One comes from main power plug, and other one heads off to the fridge, they both seem to be making contact with each other)

2XBrown Wire (one comes from main power plug, second heads off to the fridge, they do NOT make contact)

1xWhite wire (heads off to fridge)

1xBlack wire (have no idea on how to describe)

[Redwolf]

Did you look inside the plastic cover on the compressor to see if there was a wiring diagram? At the very least it will show which terminal is which.
The diagram could also be on the back of the fridge too...

R= Run winding S= Start winding C= Common

Pull off the cover and post a pic... Easier to explain it that way.

[X-tremist]

Originally posted by Redwolf
Did you look inside the plastic cover on the compressor to see if there was a wiring diagram? At the very least it will show which terminal is which.
The diagram could also be on the back of the fridge too...

R= Run winding S= Start winding C= Common

Pull off the cover and post a pic... Easier to explain it that way.

I got bad news fellas, couldn't find a wiring diagram anywhere. Kayl said he will help me out so Hooray!!!!!!!
If anyone else can, thanks in advance.

[kayl]

on this is how i wired the compressor
the two wires that connect went to the thermostat (good idea to solder then together and cover with insulation tape and make sure you put the cover back on cause terminats can pop out on startup)
if you would like to wire an AC fan you connect
a=active wire (brown) to fan +
and b=netural (blue to fan -
and the green to the metal of the fan for earthing

[Redwolf]

Looks right to me. As you can see its a lot easier to edit a pic :)

[X-tremist]

The wire colours are different, but we can sort this out. So Kayl you joined the two white wires together Am I right?

[kayl]

if they were the wires that use to got to the thermostat then they are the ones.
if they go back to the power cord then they are the incorrect ones.
ps dont forget to connect one of the green wires to the metal of the compressor so it trips the mains if compressor eva shorts.

if you still unsure take a better pic head on though like mine so its a tad clearer to see.

[X-tremist]

The brown wire that I labeled in that previous pic goes to the main cord so it won't be that then. In the following image I'm thinking it is the brown an the white wires I have to join.
They both go to the thermostat.

See the brown wire going to the thermostat (throught hte white tubbing)? You have a blue wire there instead on your compressor.

http://members.optusnet.com.au/nanayakkara61/Imagestore/Phasechange/

[kayl]

edit
reds together to disable the thermostate
and the pinks either A's and B to AC fan
im sure bottom A is ok and think other A could be used instead
someone might be able to clear that up

[X-tremist]

LOL. Thanks heaps dude!

Now I think Chilly1 answered this before, but is it alright if I run the compressor without oil?

Kayl, got any tips for the fan's wire?

[Redwolf]

Fireing the compressor up for a few secs just to see if it works will not hurt it.

The condensor fan runs at the same time the compressor does.

[kayl]

I edited the above pic so take a look
just get an AC fan (can buy 120mm versions) and wire the blue wire (neutral) to one connections on the fan
the bottom wire (active) to the other terminal of wire
im pretty sure that where you connect the thermostat wires together you could add a lead and connect that to the other terminal of the fan instead. electrically it should be the same point, can check with an ohm meter though.
and one of the green wires to the metal of the fan.

[X-tremist]

Kayl, I'm a bit confused with your new diagram, you have two arrows pointing to the same brown wire?
I will join the brown and white wire as indicated by the red arrow correct.
Thanks for the help mate.

Starting the compressor, it is not joined onto anything, i.e. condensor etc. So it will still be alright won't it?

[kayl]

if you solder a wire to bottom point a and connect that to fan along with wire b the fan will run when the compressor is plugged in

[X-tremist]

There are two earth wires, where should I just make sure they touch the compressor?

[kayl]

bolt on metal where you bolt the compressor to mounting board
but you could connect it really to any metal surface of the compressor

[X-tremist]

Fired up the compressor, it made a noise similar to a jackhammer, just quieter. Thanks for the help everyone.