AN35N Ultra Vdd, Vcore, & Vdimm Solved

[Hell-Fire]

As title says...got Vdd and Vdimm worked out juse fine.

There is an overall lack of material on the net concerning mods for this board, but after receiving a request to mod one.....off I went.

There was very little info on the net, but I did bump into a thread or 2 where people said they performed the Vdimm mod and highest value possible was 2.9v. I got well past 3.2v without issue, so not sure what problems they were having with that mod.

I am working on the Vcore mod......but not sure the board actually needs it. It overvolts from what I can tell, and the bios allows upwards of 2v. That is not xtreme mind you, but the actual Vcore is closer to 2.2v I am speculating.

Regardless, I will be setting to work on it in the morning. It appears that several chips are tied together on this one, but I think I have an idea what needs to be done.

The RT9602 has pins Phase1 and Phase2 tied directly to Vcore.....as is Vsen of the RT9241. The circuit diagram shows pins #13 and #8 (Phase1 and Phase2) of the RT9602 forming one circuit, with pin #14 (Vsen) of RT9241 joining the same circuit.

A connectivity test indeed shows that the above pins are connected, and they are also connected to Vcc of the 2 GD75232 ICs as well.

Bare in mind that RT9241 also has a FB pin, which is the traditional mod location, but I am thinking that Vsen is the target pin for now.

Any ideas are obviously welcome.

[Hell-Fire]

Ok, some odd results.

Modding Vsen on the RT9241B Vreg had some weird action to it.

Turning the VR might yield a voltage increase, but then the next 1/4 turn would yield a decrease. The voltage has steadily increased, but it still bounces up and down as the VR is adjusted. It may be 1.795, then lowering the resistance more puts the voltage at 1.738v, then lowering again pushes it back to 1.79v...?? :confused:

That is with the VR on pin #14 (Vsen) and GND. Maybe the VR should either be between Vsen and FB on the RT9241 Vreg...or maybe even between the the RT9241 and RT9602 since according to data sheets they both are connected to Vcore.

Any input?

[Hell-Fire]

**UPDATE**

Okey Dokey.

Got it all worked out it seems.

I was right to begin with. Modding Pin #14 (Vsen) on the RT9421B IC was the correct move. In my first attempt I was using a very small gauge wire and a 100k VR. I found that although the Vcore was all over the place, with the VR set to 20.22K ohms, the Vcore was +0.2v higher than the bios setting. That would yield a solid 2.2v when set to the bios max value of 2v.

I then started thinking about the wire I used and the 100K VR. So I decided to take another crack at it with a 50K VR set to 25K, and a thicker gauge wire. Worked like a charm and now the Vcore can be increased or decreased and is rock solid without flux.

I am tired, so I will update this thread with pics and the proper VRs to use later this week.

If anyone has this board and want to try out the mods, here are the VRs needed and the Vregs to modify:

Vdimm ---> LM431 (near dimms) Pin #8 to GND with 1K VR.
Vdd ---> RT9203 (between PCI and AGP) Pin #8 to GND with 100K VR.
Vcore ---> RT9241B (beside Fan #3 header) Pin #14 to GND with 50K VR.

[STEvil]

Good to see someone finally figured it out :D

[Hell-Fire]

Originally posted by STEvil
Good to see someone finally figured it out :D

Whats odd to me is that the only live pins on the LM431 are pins #1 and #8. All other pins are either tied to GND, or simply out of the circuit loop.

[celemine1Gig]

Well, THANK YOU VERY MUCH Hell-Fire!!! This Thread is exactly what I needed ATM. And respect that you figured out the VCore mod.
I'll try the mods as soon as possible.

BTW, did you also do the thermal diode mod on you board. That's what I'm planning to do soon.

Greetz

Ingmar :toast:

[Hell-Fire]

Originally posted by celemine1Gig
Well, THANK YOU VERY MUCH Hell-Fire!!! This Thread is exactly what I needed ATM. And respect that you figured out the VCore mod.
I'll try the mods as soon as possible.

BTW, did you also do the thermal diode mod on you board. That's what I'm planning to do soon.

Greetz

Ingmar :toast:

Nah, I didnt do the diode action as this isnt my board.

I did the mods on this motherboard and also mods to a 9800Pro for the owner.

I was planning on doing some MemTest86+ testing on it before giving it back to the owner, but my floppy drive is D-E-D dead. I did get boots up to 245fsb, but not sure if thats stable or not as I couldnt do testing.

The fact that it booted at 245 was nice if you ask me...if you think about the fact that this isnt considered a "performance" board.

The owner is running cascade and planning on a A64 setup soon....now thats what I call an upgrade....moving from this setup to A64. :slobber:

[Hell-Fire]

**EDIT**

This is not my pic. Someone informed us that I had the wrong read point for Vdd. Here is an updated pic showing the correct read point.


Otay, here is a pic of the board after mods:

http://home.t-online.de/home/ingmarklein/Shuttle%20AN35N-Ultra/Vmod%20overview.JPG

[STEvil]

bump ;)

[STEvil]

update

Did the vdimm mod, I still max out at 2.9v with 3.3 raill @ 3.3.

With the 3.3 rail @ 3.7 I get 3.1v which is good for 232mhz 2.5-2-2-11 on my BH-6's

The board seems to be responding better to adjusting CPU mhz also with the addition of the vdimm mod...?

EDIT

VBT/VTT tracks, also.

[celemine1Gig]

Originally posted by STEvil
update

Did the vdimm mod, I still max out at 2.9v with 3.3 raill @ 3.3.

With the 3.3 rail @ 3.7 I get 3.1v which is good for 232mhz 2.5-2-2-11 on my BH-6's

The board seems to be responding better to adjusting CPU mhz also with the addition of the vdimm mod...?

EDIT

VBT/VTT tracks, also.

Hmm, that's quite interesting STEvil! I could adjust the Vdimm to a max of 3,05V while having my 3.3V rail @ ~3,4V (didn't go higher yet, without a major mod to the PSU).
And it's good news that VTT is tracking VDimm.
BUT, I bought a DFI Lanparty Nforce2 Ultra B anyway. ;) So, we'll se, how the Shuttle, which is nearly one third of the price of the Lanparty, competes with it. :toast:

[Iggy]

I did the Vdimm and VDD mods the other day and I'm still trying to get the VDD to work. As soon as I connect pin 8 on RT9203 to any ground the 100k VR shows 0.00 ohms when it's actually set to about 30k.:confused:

[CaTalyst.X]

You cant check resistance on the VR once it is soldered in circuit bro.......If you set it at 30K before you solder it in, it will stay at 50K, the heat wont change the resistance or anything. BTW HF i am slowly starting to see the benefits of hot glue :D

-CaT

[STEvil]

My Infinity made it to 250 @ 3.45v 2-2-2-11 100% stable.

I think I need to do the VDD mod and lap the NB a bunch before i'm going to get 240 or maybe more..

I'm going to go and solder the +3.3 direct to the backside of the vdimm mosfet now to bypass the diode as the diode is in a location too tight for my soldering iron to get.. darn 325w iron ;)

This board isnt half bad once you do some work to it :D

EDIT

I meant to post this a couple hours back actually.. just got side-tracked watching Aliens and stuff :D

Anyways, on a related note.. I cant get the solder to stick to the mosfet or the diode at all.. wtf? :stick:

[STEvil]

Ok, got the solder to stick (to a different location) so vdimm is effectively driven by the +3.3 rail now instead of only +3.0v

Attaching the +3.3 directly to the source feed of the mosfet allows me to go to 3.3v on the memory without having to crank up my +3.3v line past 3.55, but even turning it up to 3.8v didnt get me past 3.3v to mem. It also hasnt raised my max FSB, I cant run CAS2 with all the extra voltage, and setting vdimm to 2.7 (3.25 real) causes errors in memtest..

Time to lap the NB and do the vdd+vcore mods I guess :D

[celemine1Gig]

BTW, I wrote a little pictured guide, which will be online soon (site is not available for the public yet, but will be soon). Thanks to Hell-Fire and AA666 who figured everything out!

[STEvil]

Vcore goes to 2.2+ with EASE :D

Too bad its such a pain to solder to the mosfets... you gotta get the suckers cooking before the solder will stick :rolleyes:


These things could have been nF7 killers.. maybe still could be with some bios tweaks? :D

[celemine1Gig]

Well, if there would be mod bioses like for the NF7 with CPC off and all the other fancy options, the shuttles really could've been killer boards. But ATM, they aren't. :(

[STEvil]

Pffft, dont need no stinking mod bios!! :D

Just need a FAST bios! :D

[celemine1Gig]

I finally got me a DFI Lanparty Ultra B. So I can now try to make my Shuttle run even faster, while still having a blazin fast system up and running on the DFI. Perhaps I'll even sell my Shuttle. :rolleyes:

[STEvil]

Did you ever play with the C1 disconnect option in the bios? I havent touched it yet.. dunno what the heck its for ;)

[Iggy]

You cant check resistance on the VR once it is soldered in circuit bro.......If you set it at 30K before you solder it in, it will stay at 50K, the heat wont change the resistance or anything. BTW HF i am slowly starting to see the benefits of hot glue

EDIT: but wait, why can I measure the resistance on my 1k which is controlling the Vdimm?

Thanks bud-I'm a vmod and electrical n00b, and I've still got alot to learn. I'll see if I can fit this on K6-2 hsf on the nb today (I have to clear the 9500's 2" tall ramsinks) and maybe finish the lap job on the nb. So far I've been able to boot at up to 230 with the VDD at stock and the Vdimm at 2.95 on my new Geil PC3200 "Value", which will do a 250 fsb, but I'll see how far I can really push this thing today.:D As always a modded bios would be a great help.

Too bad its such a pain to solder to the mosfets... you gotta get the suckers cooking before the solder will stick

No kidding-I finally had to switch to a larger tip on the Weller TC201 to get anything to stick to the Vdimm measurement point.

[STEvil]

I tightened my tip on.. it was kinda loose. Its working betting now ;)

If you remove/bypass that diode you can get more vdimm.. extra .1 or .2v anyways.

[bh2k]

every little bit helps ;)

[STEvil]

:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

Oh the lucrid smell of burning silicone... :(

Did the VDD mod, but apparently using a 100k VR is very unsafe.

Went something like this:

*install mod*
wow I am the soldering god! (ego+2)
*put dmm in measure thingy, press power*
ooh, its working!! (ego+2)
*turn turn turn turn turn.............................................. .*
hhmm.. getting kinda low on t.. WTF 0.08v??
*shut down and turn the other direction a few turns*
ok, here we go again..
*power on*
good, still works! (ego +4)
*turn VERRRRY slowlSNAP!!!*
eep. (adrenaline rush)
*insert burned silicone smell here*
sheeeet (panic sets in)
*SHUT DOWN!!!!!*
omgomgomgomgomg
*turn the other way and power on again*
ok, vdd voltage looks right... but no monitor signal!!! :(:(:(:(:(:(
*numerous reboots/cmos resets/etc later...*
NOOOOOOOOooooooooo

Ego -eleventybillion.



Well, at least it will make for good pics and I can test for max vcore since it still turns on at least.


Conclusion: Using 100k VR is bad (??????????).


Crap... no system at all now.

[Iggy]

Ouch man, that bites. Oh well, at least they're cheap. I wonder if it be safe to use a 10k on the VDD?

[STEvil]

I'm going to pull the 100k and test since all voltages are still responding normally, the chipset is just burnt out I think.

[Hell-Fire]

STEvil...its been a bit since I messed with this board, but I am staring to wonder if the Vdd mod I have posted is incorrect.

Make sure its not the Vagp mod.....

That FET leg where I am measuring Vdd, make sure thats not Vagp read point.

I dont recall if there is a bios setting for Vdd and/or Vagp, but someone check if there is and then make a couple of changes to see if that FET registers them or not. If a change to Vagp in the bios makes a change on that FET reading, then this is Vagp mod and not Vdd mod.

Someone let me know on this please so I can make a change.

BTW, a friend of mine had this board and the SB burned up quickly...check that as well STEvil.

[STEvil]

Yeah, theres a setting for vagp but none to adjust vdd. I should have verified it first.. oops ;)

If I unsolder the southbridge what do i lose feature wise other than some USB ports?


EDIT

I think maybe we do have it backwards.. the other mosfet(s) read 1.71v default.. tad high, but who knows.

[Iggy]

It's definitely backwards in the pic Hell-Fire posted-I'm reading 1.6v off of that FET leg, which is my AGP voltage. I followed this pic from Cellemine1Gig, but I still can't get any kind of increase for some reason:

http://home.t-online.de/home/ingmarklein/Shuttle%20AN35N-Ultra/Vmod%20overview.JPG

Still, this seems to be the VDD mod.

[STEvil]

The one closest the PCI slot reads 1.71v default on the left leg (has wire attached to it) and the one closest the southbridge reads 1.71v on the backside for me at default.


What I am thinking is it may prove easier to remove the VDD mosfet and link the output of the vAGP mosfet to where the output of the VDD mosfet goes...

The problem is doing so raises a few problems possibly.

[STEvil]

Cellemine1Gig - have you tested the VDD mod?

your monitoring point (as shown in Iggy's pic) is different than what myself and hell~fire did (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?postid=454772#post454772) but after checking with my DMM there is continuity bewteen both monitoring points and the backside of the mosfet closest the agp slot....

It seems the way Shuttle set up the voltage supply for vagp and VDD on this board is linked together, so if you guys are doing this mod I would be very VERY carefull...

[celemine1Gig]

Of course I tested the VDD Mod. It worked without a problem the way it can be seen on the pics. I set the VDD to 1,8V and the VAGP stayed the same, at the default 1,5V. Also set VAGP to 1,6V once, to see if they were linked, but nothing changed except 1,6V for the VAGP. ;)
You just need the right measuring point (like in my pics).
The point that you and Hell-Fire used, is the measuring point for VAGP, that's why I was confused at first, too.

[Iggy]

Ok, strange how mine still doesn't work:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=514778

Maybe you can try it out STEvil and see how it goes for you. :)

[STEvil]

I should go give this board another run.. figure that out for sure.

EDIT

OH MY GOD

:slobber:

This board is capable of putting 4.0v into the CPU (TESTED!) and nb voltage up to full +3.3 line!!!! LOL

No wonder my nb is a crispy critter.. and yes, the measure point we have is wrong hellfire.. but the VR only needs to be 25k for the VDD mod.. 50k would be best with a 1k or 2k fixed inline.

Holy crap 4.0v!!!!!!

EDIT 2

DO NOT take the board above 2.6v for "extended" use... even you LN2 guys :D I was moving up slowly and at 2.9 the board kinda fizzed at me the shut off... its a gonner completely now, lol :D

[Hell-Fire]

Roger that STE.

I will edit this so no1 else makes a fatal error.

Thanks for all for their help in this.

But just to make sure of this, my mod was correct, just had wrong read point for Vdd?

[celemine1Gig]

Originally posted by Hell-Fire
But just to make sure of this, my mod was correct, just had wrong read point for Vdd?

Exactly! The mod was absolutely right and works without any problems ;)

[Hell-Fire]

Thanks for the heads-up on that, as well as the confirmation that it does work.

Thanks to STE and celemine for getting this cleared up. :up:

[celemine1Gig]

As I said, I did a little writeup (thanks to Hell-Fire and AA666 of course and all others who helped :) ) and now it's officially online, on W1zzard's new homebase, www.techpowerup.com

Here it is:

http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/voltmods/103

Hope you'll enjoy it, i.e. you get your mods working and the board going as high as it gets :D

Greets and BIG THX again to all who helped find all mods

Ingmar :) :toast:

[Iggy]

Sorry to bring this thread up again, but I've tried everything I can think of and I still can't get the VDD mod to work. As soon as I connect pin 8 on RT9203 to ground I read a resistence of 0.0 ohms. I've tried other resistors, other ground points, resoldering all the connections, and no ground and I'm still getting no change in voltage. I've surfed through all the pics in the guide and I don't see anything different in those mods from what I've done on my board besides ground points. I'm totally stumped on this one-any thoughts guys? Here's a pic:

http://img60.exs.cx/img60/1497/5187.jpg

It looks kinda iffy in the pic but I am actually connected to pin 8, and no the 2 pins on the brown resistor are not connected to each other.

BTW that's an excellent guide celemine. :)

[celemine1Gig]

Originally posted by Iggy
Sorry to bring this thread up again, but I've tried everything I can think of and I still can't get the VDD mod to work. As soon as I connect pin 8 on RT9203 to ground I read a resistence of 0.0 ohms. I've tried other resistors, other ground points, resoldering all the connections, and no ground and I'm still getting no change in voltage. I've surfed through all the pics in the guide and I don't see anything different in those mods from what I've done on my board besides ground points. I'm totally stumped on this one-any thoughts guys? Here's a pic:

http://img60.exs.cx/img60/1497/5187.jpg

It looks kinda iffy in the pic but I am actually connected to pin 8, and no the 2 pins on the brown resistor are not connected to each other.

BTW that's an excellent guide celemine. :)

Thank you very much! Exactly what I wanted to hear (that the guide is good anot that your mod isn't working ;) :D ).

Well, did you actually try the ground points that I suggested in my guide?:rolleyes:

[Iggy]

Yes, I tried having the 20k grounded to pin 3 on RT9203 and it had no affect. The only explanation that I can come up with is that I'm somehow bypassing the circuit, although I'm not sure how that's possible, and I don't see how it would make a difference if the mobo was mounted in a case or not. Thanks again for all the help. :)

[celemine1Gig]

Originally posted by Iggy
...and I don't see how it would make a difference if the mobo was mounted in a case or not. Thanks again for all the help. :)

Well if I understand you right, then you used the mounting holes as ground, but didn't have the mobo mounted in the case when testing? If so, then don't wonder why it didn't work. AFAIK, the mountiing holes are only grounded through the case, i.e. without case, there's no ground on the mounting holes.
I was never too keen on using the mounting holes as ground as it is a bad solution anyway, in my opinion. There are better ground points all around on the PCB.

My Tip for you is to redo all the mods, that's to say desolder all cables and resolder them in the appropriate locations. IMHO, that would be the best way to finally get the mods working.

I also made a mistake when I first did the mods on the shuttle. Then I completely removed the mods and did them again as to be seen in my guide.

Give that a try and perhaps it'll work. ;)

[Iggy]

No, I've got it mounted in a case. And I know this ground works beacuse I have the Vdimm mod grounded to it as well. But I'm still going to rip the whole thing out and redo all the connections on the VDD mod (everything else is working flawlessly). I'll see if grounding it to the P4 connector makes any difference. Thanks. :)

[Hell-Fire]

Nice Guide celemine. :up:

[celemine1Gig]

Originally posted by Hell-Fire
Nice Guide celemine. :up:

Nice YOU! :D
Without your help that guide wouldn't exist! I'm not that good.

But thx anyway :p:

@Iggy:
Hope redoing the VDD-Mod will solve your issues ;)

[Iggy]

Ok, well I moved to a larger gauge wire (22) and changed the ground point to be on 12v ATX connector and so far I've had no luck. And yes my board is rev. 1.1, same as everybody else.

[Hell-Fire]

Iggy....would you consider sending the board my way??

I am curious why the mods are not working.

I would do the work for free as long as you cover parts and return shipping of course.

[Iggy]

Wow, thanks-I might, but I don't really have a replacement on hand ATM. Part of me was hoping I would able to finish these mods off on my own, but I think at this point I need to have someone take a look at it anyway-whatever is causing the problem is beyond my knowledge, and I don't think there's anything in the pics that is an obvious answer. I'd consider it if I could get an estimate on shop time (it's my only gaming ready system ATM). At this point I'm even wondering if it's worth the time and effort to finish this thing off, since I get everything I need (250 fsb, sata eventually) with an Infinity for $90.

[Iggy]

Ok, here's everything I did:

1) Changed the ground point for both the Vdimm and VDD mods to the ATX 12v connector grounds on the back of the mobo.
2) Changed the wire to 22 gauge on all connections except the pin 8 on LM341 > 1k connection.

Nothing has made any difference whatsoever. This is pretty much a last ditch attempt, but here's pics of everything at a bunch of angles:

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/1480/DSC77.jpg

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/5264/DSC78.jpg

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/4847/DSC00080.jpg

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/632/DSC00082.jpg

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/8639/DSC00086.jpg

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/401/DSC00089.jpg

Here's my last question-is it worth the effort to finish everything on this board, or should I just buy an Infinity? Thanks for all the help guys-I know how much fun a noob is lol.

[Hell-Fire]

Mods look fine to me.

Have you removed the VRs and made sure they are functioning properly??

[Iggy]

Yeah, the VRs all work fine.

[Iggy]

Ok, well after a bit of consideration I decided it would be better to get the Infinity in the long run-I was able to get my 80 gig SATA drives with it, and there's simply more information out there that'll help me hit a 250 fsb. But if you'd still like to look at the board I can probably ship it to you in a week or so Hell-Fire. I'd really like to know what's causing the VDD mod not to function, and it's definitely a good backup board (and I'm getting to the point where a backup board isn't a bad idea). Actually if you'd like to have an AN35N around that's already been sinked I'd sell it to you if you want.

[Hell-Fire]

I would be glad to look it over if you like. If this is something you plan on doing, send me a PM and we can discuss it there.

-Fire