Is AS 5 better than AS Ceramique for phase change?(MACH 2)

[brwmogazos]

Ok there are reviews out there for the AS 5 showing a few degrees lower temps compared to AS ceramique...

Its hard for me to believe that as 5 offers lower temps by a few DEGREES and not less than a degree Celcius :p

Is that just total B$? or is it true?

How about phase change now.

I am using AS Ceramique.Should i use AS 5 instead since i can get lower temps for my cpu or is AS 5 inapropriate for phase change cooling and -C temps?

[esoteradactyl]

ceramique :D

btw try the search button. its a powerful thing ;)

[CCW]

For Phase Change most people use either Ceramique or Alumina. Im not exactly sure why no one uses AS3 or 5 for Phase Change as it is a much better conductor of heat than the alumina or ceramique.

Craig

[esoteradactyl]

AS5 Specifications:

Thermal Conductance:
>350,000W/m2 °C (0.001 inch layer)
Thermal Resistance:
<0.0045°C-in2/Watt (0.001 inch layer)
Average Particle Size:
<0.49 microns <0.000020 inch
Extended Temperature Limits:
Peak: –50°C to >180°C Long-Term: –50°C to 130°C

Ceramique Specifications:

Thermal Resistance:
<0.007°C-in2/Watt (0.001 inch layer)
Thermal Conductance:
>200,000W/m2.°C (0.001 inch layer)
Average Particle Size:
<0.38 microns <0.000015 inch
( 67 particles lined up in a row equal 1/1000th of an inch. )
Temperature limits:
Peak: –150°C to >180°C Long-Term: –150°C to 125°C

[CCW]

That would explain it, it can work at much lower temperatures but seeing as prommie wont go below -50*C anyway I dont see why people dont use AS5.

[esoteradactyl]

modded prommys do ;)

[Soulburner]

Originally posted by esoteradactyl
modded prommys do ;)
If you trust their "temp sensor" it does...

:rolleyes:

[TechTones]

Originally posted by brwmogazos
Ok there are reviews out there for the AS 5 showing a few degrees lower temps compared to AS ceramique...

Its hard for me to believe that as 5 offers lower temps by a few DEGREES and not less than a degree Celcius :p

Is that just total B$? or is it true?

How about phase change now.

I am using AS Ceramique.Should i use AS 5 instead since i can get lower temps for my cpu or is AS 5 inapropriate for phase change cooling and -C temps?

Please..it's all BS. Since the release of the 1 st Arctic paste it's been a few degrees less. Well, by 5, the temps should negative by now if you look at the claims and how much each product lowered temps and each new product is supposed to be better then the last right? So temps by 5 should be super eh?

IMHO, these high quality pastes are the biggest rip off scheme that ever got going. I've tried a ton of different pastes, and none of them lowered my temps any more then 1 degree or less then Rat Shacks white thermal paste.

Now, if you compare these new pastes to the incredibly cheap white crap that was out there years ago, OK, these are better. But the new so called cheap pastes are just as good.

I know I'll see a bunch of posts how wrong I am and how you got 5 degrees over your last stuff. If you got 5 degrees less now, you either didn't have the heatsink mounted right the 1 st time, or something else was wrong.

And no, I don't believe most hardware sites.

If it helps you, then just buy it. Just stick with Arctic Alumina or Ceramique and you'll be fine. NO NEED for AS5. In fact, if it's easier to get the Radio Shack stuff in the tube only, then get that.

[nailbomb]

I agree with the above. And you just might too after you read:

http://www.dansdata.com/goop.htm

At this point, differences in long term stability should probably be the only thing that is looked at.

[st0nedpenguin]

TechTones hit the nail on the head there.

Hell, I managed to get a 3c drop in both northbridge and CPU temps last night by swapping out my Ceramique for...

Wait for it...

Ceramique.

It just points out hpw hard it is to do an accurate review of a thermal compound, application probably has more to do with results than anything else.

[skate2snow]

If you go on artic silver site you will see this: For AS2: temp drop of 5-12C. For AS3: temps drop of 5-12C. And for the AS5: temps drop of 5-12C....LOL there is no focking difference between all those thermal paste...:lol:

[nailbomb]

It just points out hpw hard it is to do an accurate review of a thermal compound, application probably has more to do with results than anything else.

Good point. Actually when you start thinking about it, there could be all kinds of variables. Is the mounting pressure exactly the same every time you apply the sink? Probably not. Did you use the exactl same amount of compound, with the same application method. Probably not. Is your ambient room temp the same. Probably not.

The Dan's Data article tries to remove some of variables from the equation and comes to the conclusion that paste is pretty much paste.

Now, obviously since Ceramique can tolerate lower temps, that would be the criteria for the phase changers. But as to the claims of these huge drops in temps, I'm skeptical. Unless you are talking about going from a stock thermal pad, then I buy it, because THAT I have seen.

[jmke]

the temp difference is compared to GENERIC PASTE. not their the previous AS incarnation. :)

[CCW]

Originally posted by jmke
the temp difference is compared to GENERIC PASTE. not their the previous AS incarnation. :)

What he means though is that they all claim to give the same lowered temps of 3-12*C over generic paste thus they are all the same.

[Mr. Thompson]

The Dan's Data tests are very misleading. If you would like to further your education and understand why, read all three pages of this thread (http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/ubb.x?q=Y&a=tpc&s=50009562&f=77909585&m=7970973985&p=1).


skate2snow – Some the pages you quote are three years old. As our products have improved, we have driven the market, forcing some of our competitors to improve their products, hence the relative numbers remain the about same. Furthermore, with the use of heatspreaders becoming more common, (if you finished reading the thread linked to above, you know what’s next. ;) ) the increase in surface area has reduced the difference in relative performance between thermal compounds.

Colin Thompson
Arctic Silver, Inc.

[cir108]

Ever heard of the phrase, " Blind Leading the Blind"?

That's because we all have different reasons for making different statements in different situations, regardless of how genuine we are at the time when we are making those statements.

If you want to use my "eyes", however, and you shouldn't, really, I'm using AS5 on everything I can find a reason to.

This is partly because it costs a mere £3+ and partly because there is so much left after I've used it on my CPUs, that I know it will be wasted if I don't. Besides, I am "certain" that it gave me lower temps compared to AS3 & some Shin-Etsus. It's also used on a Vapo PE at the evaporator-CPU contact area only, of course.

Not being cynical or a smart arse but for £3+, your own eyes cannot be beaten.

[Grace]

Well...my opinion for the initial question (too bored to read the whole debate, sorry) is that you should stick with the ceramique.

To start, artic silver (all of the series) have problems with minus temperatures. Under -30c or so the particles of the silver freeze (or something like that ex-Chipcon told me). You will LOSE about 5-10c compared to Ceramique which is unnaffected by cold (to a limit) if you are using any evaporator that will go lower than that, and even an unmodded prometeia will in your case. At least all of the systems using such cooling around me and tried silver based products did.

[Hell-Fire]

Originally posted by skate2snow
If you go on artic silver site you will see this: For AS2: temp drop of 5-12C. For AS3: temps drop of 5-12C. And for the AS5: temps drop of 5-12C....LOL there is no focking difference between all those thermal paste...:lol:

But wait, when As6 comes out.....err, 5-12C temp drop I bet.

BTW, you are one mean posting machine Skate...you have over 1200 posts and registered in Nov......falling asleep on your keyboard again are we? :hehe: Just 2 days ago I cam across a thread of yours where you had 1000 posts or so...now ya got 200 more than that. Your fingers must be hurting by now. Go hug your girlfriend and give your computer a break man. :banana:

[docah]

The only reason i've found to buy a new tube of paste is ... the onld one got lost or ran out.

[PimpJack]

this is ridiculous. If u have thermal paste than don't buy the new §§§§ but if u run out and need to get some more than buy the freaking AS 5.

As for the origional question the ceramique looks better.

How does shinetsu come into play?

[Grace]

Originally posted by PimpJack

How does shinetsu come into play?

Shin Etsu is better for +5c and above temperatures but at lower temperatures it freezes and even moves off the surface. Not good for low temperatures.

[TASOS]

Originally posted by Grace
To start, artic silver (all of the series) have problems with minus temperatures. Under -30c or so the particles of the silver freeze (or something like that ex-Chipcon told me).

I agree with Grace.

I've seen it with my own eyes.
All the arctic silver (2,3,5) i've tested with my Prommie had the same results.

After a weeks use,they no longer look like paste any more.
It looks like sand.

You should stick with the ceramique.

[thirdeye]

Originally posted by CCW
What he means though is that they all claim to give the same lowered temps of 3-12*C over generic paste thus they are all the same.

how about improved viscosity or life of the product?
a new tire that comes out may not offer improved traction, just improved tread wear...

[CCW]

Originally posted by thirdeye
how about improved viscosity or life of the product?
a new tire that comes out may not offer improved traction, just improved tread wear...

Actually, one of the first things I noticed about AS5 compared to AS3 was its viscosity. It is very thick, and I noted this in my review and went into some detail to explain how it feels to me.

Craig