Winbond CH5 - doesnt work on Athlon64 ?

[matt simis]

Hi,

I just recieved a stick of 512MB TwinMos PC3200 with Winbond CH5 chips, to complement my 2x256MB TwinMos PC3200 Winbond BH5.

The CH5 stick wont work properly (even on its own) in the Abit KV8-Max3. No matter what voltage or speed, it blues screens on Windows login and eventually corrupts Windows. :(

Thinking it was bad memory I tried it on my gfs shuttle pc (845e based) and it worked fine, at 2.5v, 190MHz DDR speed. As I said, it wouldnt work at any (even 166MHz) speed on the Athlon64 mobo.

Hopefully I can swap it with a co-worker for a BH5 stick, but just thought this info may be useful to someone.



Matt

[STEvil]

tried 2-3-2-6?

[matt simis]

Afaik, I tried 2-3-2-7... it doesnt have to be those exact settings does it? I also tried SPD settings.


Matt

[mikem]

The a64 platform can be really picky with mem timings...try loosing them all, and if it works, start tighting them one at a time.

[matt simis]

Ill try everything slowest, but it may be no good to me anyhow as it doesnt even post with all 3 dimms installed!



Matt (hating the KV8)

[Warden]

I picked up a stick of Hyper-X 3500 for my A64 rig. I've been told it's CH-5 but I can't say for sure. Anyway, it will run absolutely rock solid at CAS 2 all the way up to 240mhz but refuses to boot at CAS 2.5 at any speed, go figure.

Warden

[st0nedpenguin]

Originally posted by Warden
I picked up a stick of Hyper-X 3500 for my A64 rig. I've been told it's CH-5 but I can't say for sure. Anyway, it will run absolutely rock solid at CAS 2 all the way up to 240mhz but refuses to boot at CAS 2.5 at any speed, go figure.

Warden

:confused:

[xgman]

mismatch. You really need to use matching sticks on this to be most effective and less chance of error anyway.

[Speed_Mechanic]

Originally posted by matt simis
Ill try everything slowest, but it may be no good to me anyhow as it doesnt even post with all 3 dimms installed!



Matt (hating the KV8)

The Athlon 64 3200+ only supports DDR400+ operation with 2 DIMMs installed. Once you put 3 in, you are upsetting the memory controller found on the processor. There are processor limitations to the memory speed can go once you use up 3 DIMMs. Using the CH-5 by itself should allow it to function as it's suppose to.

[drunkenmaster]

meh, my kingston bh-5 pc3200 wouldn't run cas 2,2,2,5 at first, only around cas2,3,3,6, that was for around 2 days, at the moment runnin 2x512 sticks at cas 2,2,2,5 in nf3. It was in the abit kv8 max before, though only one stick, was plyaing with that, foudn ram fine, mobo severly lacking with an ati card so board went.

Try it at below 2.8v, as i also seemed to not be able to run tight timings above that even after the two days. Its great ain't it, almsot all abit max 3 boards have problems with high vdimm, they have same core voltage options as most boards, lower actually afaik, the ic7 max 3 is outdone by the msi board afaik. Also epox and msi outdo it on vdimm in the first place, at 3.3v, (3.4 on the msi?, mine overvolted though) and this supposedly needs the otes stuff to keep it cool enough to offer good voltages??

not to mention the otes interferes with the mounting bracket, and has lost the crummy non contacting sinks on mosfets that were on the ic7 max 3 version. Whats the reason for this overclockers board again????????????????????????

Answers on a post card to :- Abit@failedideas.com

[matt simis]

The CH5 based chips didnt work correctly even on the their own (blue screens at 200MHz). I gave it to a coworker who had it running at 200MHz in a 845E board.

I tried a Twinmos Winbond BH5 (which I know works upto 220MHz) and it was better than the CH5 chips. Would boot but totally unstable at 200MHz with all three DIMMs installed. When using 1x 256MB BH5 and 1x 512MB BH5 i could overclock the mem upto a pathetic 208Mhz. When using the 2x 256MB chips I was running at 225MHz.

I was planning on getting another 256MB (single sided) DIMM, to give me 768MB and all three DIMMs in use.. but what you are saying above is that there could be problems with full DIMM banks in use... do you have any sources for that?



Matt

[xgman]

Sound like a bad MB then.

[matt simis]

Why does it work perfectly with 2x 256MB DIMMs then?



Matt

[xgman]

Well nevertheless, you really shouldn't mix different types of ram even with the same chips. They are different size sticks and may be different lots and for all you know may have different spd's. I would start by sending the twinmos back and trying soemthing different then. Just make sure they all match. The board is just too sensitive. Also don't be afraid to use 2.9v.

[Speed_Mechanic]

Originally posted by matt simis
I was planning on getting another 256MB (single sided) DIMM, to give me 768MB and all three DIMMs in use.. but what you are saying above is that there could be problems with full DIMM banks in use... do you have any sources for that?

It's limited by the memory controller on the A64 processor. It can't handle 3X DIMMs at DDR400.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/24659.PDF

An unbuffered 2 DIMM configuration requires up to six differential clock pairs, an unbuffered 3 DIMM configuration requires up to nine clock pairs. Since the AMD Athlon 64 processor provides only six clock pairs for unbuffered configurations, the use of an external clock buffer is recommended.
3 x8 single rank or x16 x8 single rank or x16 x8 single rank or x16 DDR333
3 x8 single rank or x16 x8 single rank or x16 x8 double rank DDR200
3 x8 single rank or x16 x8 double rank x8 single rank or x16 DDR200
3 x8 single rank or x16 x8 double rank x8 double rank DDR200
3 x8 double rank x8 single rank or x16 x8 single rank or x16 DDR333
3 x8 double rank x8 single rank or x16 x8 double rank DDR200
3 x8 double rank x8 double rank x8 single rank or x16 DDR200
3 x8 double rank x8 double rank x8 double rank DDR200

[matt simis]

Hmm... the Abit manual doesnt make any reference to such limitations (no surprise there). Do any A64 boards feature an external buffer? I seem to remember Anand tech mentioning that these boards could handle 3 Dimms with no limitations..


Matt

[Speed_Mechanic]

Even if a motherboard existed with an external buffer, the additional latency would make the benefits of having an onboard memory controller cease to be meaningful.

[Hell-Fire]

Something to think about as well guys is that CH5 has all kind of compat issues with many systems out there.

I had 4 sticks of CH5, none worked even at the rated speed of 434, didnt matter what voltage or timings I used. I RMA'd em and got lucky cause I got back BH5 chips and they are running 450 fsb at the moment without a problem.

I know this is about the 64 mobo/cpu combo, but maybe the main issue besides dimm limitations as you discussed earlier, is that maybe there are compat issues with CH5 chips until maybe a new bios release.