Bad news for current Blu-Ray owners

[Syn.]

So its more expensive, its unfinished, most current features dont work, it has region lock and now its asking current owners of Blu-Ray players to buy new players if they want to have the true Blu-Ray HD experience, or they can just buy a PS3.

So tell me again does higher bit rate and more space so that you can put in pure audio on one disk really make up for the crap BDA is trying to pull?

Blu-ray may have taken a commanding lead in the next-generation format war, but the group has a big problem looming: early supporters of the format will be left out in the cold when the Blu-ray Disc Association introduces BD Profile 2.0

None of the Profile 1.0 players can be upgraded to Profile 1.1, which was finalized recently, with the exception of the PlayStation 3 -- whose update arrived in mid-December. Likewise, Profile 2.0 is expected to arrive in October bringing Internet connectivity that Profile 1.1 players lack.

But hey the only support current BD owners will get from BDA is:

When BetaNews asked developers of BD Live whether they were concerned about a backlash from early adopters who supported the format from the beginning, we were told: "They knew what they were getting into."

Oh and off course the blame for all this mess is pointed at HDDVD camp.

When BetaNews asked why these manufacturers rushed out players that were not fully capable and potentially buggy due to their BD-J implementation, the Blu-ray partner pointed blame across the room to HD DVD. "We should have waited another year to introduce Blu-ray to the public, but the format war changed the situation," he said. HD DVD was already coming and the BDA had no choice but to launch Blu-ray.

I am still to see a reason why anyone would support BD exclusively over HDDVD.

Source:
http://www.betanews.com/article/Bluray_Early_adopters_knew_what_they_were_getting_ into/1199841379

Saw it at [H]:
http://www.hardocp.com/news.html?news=MzAxMTYsLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdCwsLDE=

[deathman20]

Man what total BS. First of all not having a complete format without upgrade capibility, and then blame HD DVD when they released there players that where capibile of said features. Only people they can blame is themselves.

[chunkylover77]

I don't think it really matters what us the customer thinks. The movie companies are starting to make up their minds and it seems that Blu-Ray is taking over.

[Brother Esau]

And this is the Justifiable reason why people Hack and do Torrent Sharing because these :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:s do nothing but steal from us and Lie to us but ...oh thats right we cant give them a taste of their own medicine what we do is illegal :rolleyes: Somebody please define the parameters between right and wrong again without the use of the double standard :banana::banana::banana::banana: that they use.


Like Jimmy Hoffa said the FIX IS IN!

[Eastcoasthandle]

...PlayStation 3 is currently the only player they would recommend, due to upcoming changes to the platform. But Pioneer, Samsung, Panasonic and Sony have all been selling standalone Blu-ray players to customers...

In order to allay confusion, the BDA has adopted special labels that will be placed on Blu-ray movies. Those with a "Bonus View" sticker will require Profile 1.1 players, while those with "BD Live" will require Profile 2.0...

BDA President Andy Parsons echoed that sentiment at the Blu-ray press conference Monday, telling BetaNews that it's normal for new technology to change and older hardware to become obsolete. He added that early Blu-ray owners can continue to do everything they could in the beginning: watch movies in high-definition.
Source (http://www.betanews.com/article/Bluray_Early_adopters_knew_what_they_were_getting_ into/1199841379)
:pimp:
:rofl: :ROTF: :clap: :slap:

[MotF Bane]

So, how much money got slipped into Warner Bros' collective pockets?

[Eastcoasthandle]

So, how much money got slipped into Warner Bros' collective pockets?





...At the 11th hour, Fox went to Sony with its concerns and received a reported $120 million payout to stay with Blu-ray.

With no studio joining them on the HD DVD side, Warner's hand was forced and it went with Blu-ray, receiving a reported $500 million for doing so...


Source (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08012/848675-96.stm) is from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

[naokaji]

Somebody please define the parameters between right and wrong again without the use of the double standard :banana::banana::banana::banana: that they use.

big comapny with lobbyists in goverment makes money form it = right
everything else = wrong.

atleast thats what there definition seems to be... not really surprised about it though since they its pretty clear where they fit in.

[cozwin]

Source (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08012/848675-96.stm) is from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

ey thats messed up tbh.. but thing is it wont be only sony paying out blue ray is owned by many companys check wiki for more details

[CBONE]

In order to allay confusion, the BDA has adopted special labels that will be placed on Blu-ray movies. Those with a "Bonus View" sticker will require Profile 1.1 players, while those with "BD Live" will require Profile 2.0...

:rofl: :ROTF:
Good thing that's not confusing! :rolleyes: I was worried for a minute that they would come up with something that would be totally unclear and would end up pissing people off while making their current shelved product highly unattractive even as prices go down! :rofl: :ROTF:

[Monkeywoman]

w00t PS3 FTW!!!!

[Shintai]

Its one of the main reasons on why companies now change from HHDVD to Bluray. Super tight DRM, try and guess what the internet connectivity for 2.0 is gonna be sued for. Dictating what you may and not may.

Its nothing new Bluray changes so much that they invalidate previous formats. Now they done it twice. Whenever they need to sell more they will do it again.

Blurays only advantage is bigger discsize for something we will never use on a movie disc. But they made sure that you get messed up badly with DRM so your player and what else will be obsolete. They thight the DRM so hard that even NSA gets jealous. And you gonna have to buy new discs more often due to less protection layer. Unless you also bought that marketing bull. And enjoy Sonys royalties on bluray. You will never see a cheap optical again.

Anyway, welcome to corporate goverment.

[Serra]

Oh quit your bellyaching people. Let's look at a few things you never complained about before on regular DVD players:

1. HDMI output (yes, it's a feature you had to buy a new DVD player for because the drives didn't incorporate it or DVI into the spec... sounds a lot like this Internet capability stuff to me)
2. Surround-sound formats like DTS. Early players won't have this.
3. Ability to read non-DVD-native content (ie. AVI, MPEG 4, etc). I know this didn't come out for years.

This clearly happened with DVD players over about a 10 year span and you're foolish if you thought it wouldn't happen again. IMO, be glad that you can upgrade from 1.0 to 1.1 on some platforms - I've never known a DVD player that let you do even that much.

[Eastcoasthandle]

w00t PS3 FTW!!!!

Removal of the emotion chip to reduce cost so that you can't play last gen games FTW...wait, what? :shakes:

The 40Gig doesn't offer backwards compatibility and the 80 Gig offers software emulation. Yay! No emotion chip :D

[flopper]

chinise HD format will most likely have a field day soon.

[Skratch]

Removal of the emotion chip to reduce cost so that you can't play last gen games FTW...wait, what? :shakes:

The 40Gig doesn't offer backwards compatibility and the 80 Gig offers software emulation. Yay! No emotion chip :D

I have the 60g do I have the chip?

[Eastcoasthandle]

I have the 60g do I have the chip?

Not to get OT but you are going to need to contact the manufacture and give them your serial number (and whatever else they ask for) and verify with them. They no longer sell 60Gig models.

[RaZz!]

haha, man, i hate the new data media. cd and dvd pwn the :banana::banana::banana::banana: out of hddvd/bluray ;F

[virtualrain]

None of the Profile 1.0 players can be upgraded to Profile 1.1, which was finalized recently, with the exception of the PlayStation 3 -- whose update arrived in mid-December. Likewise, Profile 2.0 is expected to arrive in October bringing Internet connectivity that Profile 1.1 players lack.

Not True! My BDP-S300 player can be updated.

[Super strokey]

Im a blu ray guy but this is rediculious. Talk about screwing teh consumer. Im glad i got a PS3 but this stuff just isnt cool

[Eastcoasthandle]

Not True! My BDP-S300 player can be updated.

Could you link me to the specs that show the BDP-S300 having
256 MB Local Storage Capability
Secondary video decoder
Secondary audio decoder
Virtual file system
:confused:

[Loque]

Am I the only one happy with DivX quality for movies ? <_<

[Yukon Trooper]

Yikes. Too bad.

[Syn.]

Oh quit your bellyaching people. Let's look at a few things you never complained about before on regular DVD players:

1. HDMI output (yes, it's a feature you had to buy a new DVD player for because the drives didn't incorporate it or DVI into the spec... sounds a lot like this Internet capability stuff to me)
2. Surround-sound formats like DTS. Early players won't have this.
3. Ability to read non-DVD-native content (ie. AVI, MPEG 4, etc). I know this didn't come out for years.


1) HDMI didnt come up until years later with the whole HD era so of course you would have to buy a new one, most old dvd players where dying away so people kind of had to get new ones.

2) DTS is optional and as times went new sound formats where introduced. This again came over years of development but important fact was DVD came out in final spec.

3) The whole home made videos option for DVD players only came in recently with HTPC and Media Players becoming the norm.

[STaRGaZeR]

Am I the only one happy with DivX quality for movies ? <_<

Seems so. And that's bad :p:

[Sheik]

Enjoys his blu-ray movies on PS3 and laughs at people poking at blu-ray / hd-dvd and what ever draws new headlines ....

[Skratch]

Not to get OT but you are going to need to contact the manufacture and give them your serial number (and whatever else they ask for) and verify with them. They no longer sell 60Gig models.

not that I really care but it was 500 so it better come with it lol

[Kallenator]

Enjoys his blu-ray movies on PS3 and laughs at people poking at blu-ray / hd-dvd and what ever draws new headlines ....

I am going to join that one! Watching Transformers in full HD is just mind blowing! :D

[Serra]

<in response to my post>

1) HDMI didnt come up until years later with the whole HD era so of course you would have to buy a new one, most old dvd players where dying away so people kind of had to get new ones.

2) DTS is optional and as times went new sound formats where introduced. This again came over years of development but important fact was DVD came out in final spec.

3) The whole home made videos option for DVD players only came in recently with HTPC and Media Players becoming the norm.

Web-enabled content is pretty new too. In fact, it's downright cutting edge. Let's call it a new feature that didn't exist when they were first drafting the standard for Blu-Ray too. Also, you can't argue that most old DVD players were dying, that's a complete cop-out. I know plenty of people who have original DVD players and people who had them die before HDMI came out too. The fact is, it's effectively a new jack on your Blu-Ray player, and boo-hoo if your original didn't come with it.

DTS is optional, as are the features listed. Picture in picture isn't exactly required, is it? Nor is additional bonus material. It's not stopping you from watching the movie.

Lastly... mode made movies only came in recently? Don't make me laugh. I remember in 2002 people wanted to take the movies they had compressed and watch them on their home DVD player... HTPC's have nothing to do with it. Worse, an HTPC is a PC... DVD player specs have nothing to do with those, they have software up the wazoo to make up for any shortcomings.

The fact remains - DVD players also had upgrades added on over time. You couldn't upgrade the firmware on your DVD players at all, and no one complained. Blu-Ray is just adding on some big features now so they don't become obsolete later.

[iddqd]

Am I the only one happy with DivX quality for movies ? <_<

Depends on the encoding bit rate. But yeah, generally anything comparable to DVD5 quality (not even DVD9) is perfectly fine.

[CBONE]

The fact remains - DVD players also had upgrades added on over time. You couldn't upgrade the firmware on your DVD players at all, and no one complained. Blu-Ray is just adding on some big features now so they don't become obsolete later.

I think the point is that when DVD was just introduced and trying to get a foothold in homes, how many features were added that obsoleted the DVD players that people had already purchased, requiring them to buy new ones? Keep in mind that DVD only had to compete with VHS and didn't have a competing high-quality standard breathing down its neck.

[MaxxxRacer]

.MKV ftw

[Repoman]

Web-enabled content is pretty new too. In fact, it's downright cutting edge. Let's call it a new feature that didn't exist when they were first drafting the standard for Blu-Ray too. Also, you can't argue that most old DVD players were dying, that's a complete cop-out. I know plenty of people who have original DVD players and people who had them die before HDMI came out too. The fact is, it's effectively a new jack on your Blu-Ray player, and boo-hoo if your original didn't come with it.

DTS is optional, as are the features listed. Picture in picture isn't exactly required, is it? Nor is additional bonus material. It's not stopping you from watching the movie.

Lastly... mode made movies only came in recently? Don't make me laugh. I remember in 2002 people wanted to take the movies they had compressed and watch them on their home DVD player... HTPC's have nothing to do with it. Worse, an HTPC is a PC... DVD player specs have nothing to do with those, they have software up the wazoo to make up for any shortcomings.

The fact remains - DVD players also had upgrades added on over time. You couldn't upgrade the firmware on your DVD players at all, and no one complained. Blu-Ray is just adding on some big features now so they don't become obsolete later.

Too bad HDMI, DTS, and AVI/MPEG4 are all unnecessary for simply watching a movie, whereas if I read this correctly:

View Post
In order to allay confusion, the BDA has adopted special labels that will be placed on Blu-ray movies. Those with a "Bonus View" sticker will require Profile 1.1 players, while those with "BD Live" will require Profile 2.0...

New BD discs with "Bonus view" and "BD Live" will require the new players. Any DVD released now will play on any DVD player, even the very first ones.

[Eastcoasthandle]

Too bad HDMI, DTS, and AVI/MPEG4 are all unnecessary for simply watching a movie, whereas if I read this correctly:



New BD discs with "Bonus view" and "BD Live" will require the new players. Any DVD released now will play on any DVD player, even the very first ones.
Agreed!
I still have my original double sided WS/FS 5th Element limited edition (or whatever they called it) DVD that plays perfectly finel on either my old Apex dvd player or new DVD player :up: .

[Veritas.no]

So what's the bad thing here? Can't people use their players to watch blu rays any more?

[Donnie27]

So what's the bad thing here? Can't people use their players to watch blu rays any more?



The fact remains - DVD players also had upgrades added on over time. You couldn't upgrade the firmware on your DVD players at all, and no one complained. Blue-Ray is just adding on some big features now so they don't become obsolete later.

You left out one very important part. PRICE:shocked: How could you so cavalierly dismiss the large amount of money folks paid for Blue Ray Players? I bought a nice little Toshiba DVD for $29 but can't use HDMI because my TV doesn't support HDCP. But Composite (RGB) works great! HDMI worked fine with my 22" LCD though.

[Jimmer411]

Oh quit your bellyaching people. Let's look at a few things you never complained about before on regular DVD players:

1. HDMI output (yes, it's a feature you had to buy a new DVD player for because the drives didn't incorporate it or DVI into the spec... sounds a lot like this Internet capability stuff to me)
2. Surround-sound formats like DTS. Early players won't have this.
3. Ability to read non-DVD-native content (ie. AVI, MPEG 4, etc). I know this didn't come out for years.

This clearly happened with DVD players over about a 10 year span and you're foolish if you thought it wouldn't happen again. IMO, be glad that you can upgrade from 1.0 to 1.1 on some platforms - I've never known a DVD player that let you do even that much.





Those are nothing compared to this bluray BS.


1. How many people even use HDMI today? not enough. Its also a feature that was not around at the launch of DVD 10 years ago.

2. DTS surround sound... again not a huge selling point for the majority of people when DVD did come out.

3. Another minor thing to gripe about. This is like complaining that early CD players didnt play MP3 and WMA files.




Even despite all those changes people with the first DVD players were still able to play DVD's... ALL DVDs.

[accord99]

Even despite all those changes people with the first DVD players were still able to play DVD's... ALL DVDs.
So will BD 1.0 players, they will play the movie; just not the additional features.

[Serra]

Wow, so many posts to reply to that I'm not even going to use quotes anymore. I'll just go for some blanket replies.

From my understanding of things, this is - and I stress - additional content. It is not the movie, or even just regular special features. These are features that go above and beyond traditional DVD viewing experiences. Extras all the way. Anyone who tells me "HDMI is optional LOL" again is getting a smack with a trout - so is watching a movie with PIP.

As for the "LOL COST" argument - what do you think DVD players cost when they first came out? I have a friend who paid nearly $1000 for his when they first came out, and was *quickly* annoyed to discover things like DTS coming out which gave him less than optimal sound.

You consider these big features? Then be glad that some of you will be able to upgrade your players to 1.1, stop moaning that to watch content you haven't thought of including with a movie before you'll have to buy a new player.

[Eastcoasthandle]

So will BD 1.0 players, they will play the movie; just not the additional features.


To just watch a movie means playing a inexpensive dvd player with a inexpensive dvd. To experience HDM means paying a premium, higher then what most DVD and DVD players cost. To watch a movie that offers a higher definition with improved features not offered using DVD. The HDM Experience IMO is synonymous with creature comforts. :up:

[The_Beast]

:down: that really sucks

[Scubar]

Well in all fairness it was a smart move on their part to launch the Blu Ray players early and buggy, they knew that if HD DVD launched first it would soon get a big following as its the only available HD format. Kinda like the Xbox 360 vs PS3 war. Xbox360 came out early so gained alot of early support but the more powerful and in the end better console is the PS3.

The early stuff is buggy, so what thats what happens with most new things. I think a smart move would be to have a trade in wheere you can trade your old Blu Ray player in for a newer model that supports all the features. Of course this wont happen but it would be nice if someone did it.

In the end the tactic has paid off because Blu Ray has won the format war and now they can start perfecting it and lowering prices in the future.

[en4cer]

AND THE WINNER IS ...... HD-DVD :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[Eastcoasthandle]

To invest in a HDM is like investing in a Bentley. Telling them you paid the premium to just watch a movie is telling that Bentley owner "it's just a car for transportation". We all know the simplicity of what we buy but we pay a premium for the creature comforts and added luxuries not found with traditional standards.
So please don't insult people by telling them they paid the premium to "just watch a movie". They deserve better then that!

[Haltech]

.MKV ftw

:woot:

[Syn.]

AND THE WINNER IS ...... HD-DVD :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Who is the winner is not important here, it is who is the loser?

We the consumers are the losers here no matter what format wins be it BD or HDDVD. There will be some people which payed for the players that aren't going to be used in the future, but that's not the biggest problem. The problem here is that the format that is now most likely to win is not the one that we consumers want and need the most but it would be one that cheated the consumers right to choose and payed its way to win.

I like to make my own choice and not be told what to do by some business men that only think about margins and profits. They can kiss my ass goodbye.

[Soulburner]

Who is the winner is not important here, it is who is the loser?

We the consumers are the losers here no matter what format wins be it BD or HDDVD. There will be some people which payed for the players that aren't going to be used in the future, but that's not the biggest problem. The problem here is that the format that is now most likely to win is not the one that we consumers want and need the most but it would be one that cheated the consumers right to choose and payed its way to win.

I like to make my own choice and not be told what to do by some business men that only think about margins and profits. They can kiss my ass goodbye.
You speak as if you speak "for the people". Well I'm sorry my friend, you are wrong and disillusioned if you think that all "we consumers" share your thoughts.

[Donnie27]

Wow, so many posts to reply to that I'm not even going to use quotes anymore. I'll just go for some blanket replies.

From my understanding of things, this is - and I stress - additional content. It is not the movie, or even just regular special features. These are features that go above and beyond traditional DVD viewing experiences. Extras all the way. Anyone who tells me "HDMI is optional LOL" again is getting a smack with a trout - so is watching a movie with PIP.

As for the "LOL COST" argument - what do you think DVD players cost when they first came out? I have a friend who paid nearly $1000 for his when they first came out, and was *quickly* annoyed to discover things like DTS coming out which gave him less than optimal sound.

You consider these big features? Then be glad that some of you will be able to upgrade your players to 1.1, stop moaning that to watch content you haven't thought of including with a movie before you'll have to buy a new player.

:rofl: :down: How long has Blue Ray been on the market? For the record, I didn't buy into this or anything Sony is tied to. I hate them about as much as Informal hates Intel, oh brother.

[Donnie27]

You speak as if you speak "for the people". Well I'm sorry my friend, you are wrong and disillusioned if you think that all "we consumers" share your thoughts.

QFT!:up:

[Donnie27]

Philips Blu-Ray Disc Triple Writer Internal DrivePrice: $549.99 (http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=169689&WT.mc_n=4&WT.mc_t=U&cm_ven=COMPARISON%20SHOPPING&cm_cat=GOOGLE&cm_pla=DATAFEED->PRODUCTS&cm_ite=1%20PRODUCT&cm_keycode=4)

PS3 can't Write! Need to wait for the newer version of this too?

[Eastcoasthandle]

Looks like even if you have a PiP enabled BR player some BR titles only allow you to hear either the commentary or the movie. Even though you can view PiP within a movie you can only hear one picture at a time. I await reviews from Resident Evil and SunShine to see if profile 1.1 movies have this flaw as well. The OP also stated that when you enable PiP in the middle of the movie you are sent back to the beginning. Using a PS3 mind you.
Source (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12776411&postcount=1).

I thought they had this sorted out already :shakes:

[tbone8ty]

blu-ray = mitt romney

hddvd = ron paul

[awdrifter]

Depends on the encoding bit rate. But yeah, generally anything comparable to DVD5 quality (not even DVD9) is perfectly fine.

I'm also perfectly happy with DVD's quality. :banana::banana::banana::banana: HD formats with their damn DRM, I'm going to stick with DVD for movies until they don't make them anymore.

[aMp]

blu-ray = mitt romney

hddvd = ron paul

Wait, so Bluray is pretty but has no substance, and HD-DVD is fundamentally decent but stands zero chance of winning despite its vocal but self-deluded supporters?

[nemrod]

So buy a HDDVD player...




... in few months you will have no new films :D

Or stay with bluray, and lose the ability to have new click-click-bling-bling gadget, and only have a hd film player, what a shame... :rolleyes:

I'm neither a bluray fan, neither a HDDVD fan. I just want one die. Keeping both format alive is stupid. And now hddvd has lose and should die.

[Shintai]

Its sad to see some bluray people not even understanding what they eat raw. I guess marketing and corporate governance wins again.

In the future we can only say, "We told you so". When you curse over having to buy new bluray players, poor discs, heavy premiums on players and medias etc.

[Soulburner]

The smart ones never bought a standalone Blu-ray player to begin with.

This is a mess for the people who did, and I'm not going to defend someone else's buying decision - it's their money.

However I think this is blown a bit out of proportion. This only deals with special functions, extras, and internet connectivity. All Blu-Ray discs will play in all Blu-ray players. Nothing is stopping you from seeing any of the main features on the disc.

[Jimmer411]

Anyone who tells me "HDMI is optional LOL" again is getting a smack with a trout - so is watching a movie with PIP.




I think your confusing HDMI with HDCP. HDMI is optional, look DisplayPort. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Displayport Look at the supporters as well.

[nemrod]

Its sad to see some bluray people not even understanding what they eat raw. I guess marketing and corporate governance wins again.


Just marketing? A lot of people just want nice video quality. HDDVD or bluray is about the same. DRM who care, there is no drm on dvd perhaps? region-free, how many people buy in others countries, dvd are region free?

And you gonna have to buy new discs more often due to less protection layer.

5 mm of butter or 100µm of diamond which one is better?
Yes, I know big rental compagnies go bluray due to big bribe, despite we can't play a bluray even one time before it is destroy, the player too, and that burn your feet too...
:shock:

[Syn.]

You speak as if you speak "for the people". Well I'm sorry my friend, you are wrong and disillusioned if you think that all "we consumers" share your thoughts.

Nope i know what you think and most others, its the reason why we have all this dodgy deals going on. You guys just dont give a toss and are going to continue buying same stuff you get told to buy.

So when i was speaking "for the people" i was actually talking about guys like me who hate every ignorant bastard out there for f***ing up things for me just because they do not care.

[pacific vortex]

just made my ps3 investment look better....

[Eastcoasthandle]

It's obvious that most here who stand by their position will agree to disagree with the issues at hand with this format war.
Some see the inherit flaws of one format over the other
Some only see one format
While others feel vindicated that their PS3 finally has some worth because it failed miserably as a gaming console against the xbox 360 and Wii.

In the end, when you people don't see the implications of how consumers are affected as a whole you simply don't see the whole picture. Consumers still have a choice and its to buy or not to buy. As it stand to date, they made a decision not to buy.

[deathman20]

just made my ps3 investment look better....

Indeed. Guess this would be a huge reason why the PS3 is good in that respect. If I wanted to get a blu-ray player, i'd pick up a PS3, and probably would of originally because its dual purpose, movie player and game player.

My first DVD player was a PS2, but I did own DVD's before that just never had "my own" player til the PS2.

[Donnie27]

Never trusted the Root Kit King Sony=P After the win prices are already inching up. I kinda see and irony in all of the. No part of the world have more Warezers than Asia but most of their DRM ends schemes up here.

I never bought Blue-ray or HD-DVD. Now that BD has won, get ready for the draconian DRM crap to show it true form soon. Like; Having your set top get permission to show your movie, commercials that can't be skipped, Discs limited to ONE PLAYER only. You'll have to buy additional copies for other players in your house or apartment. No loaning movies to the neighbors LOL!

[Serra]

I think your confusing HDMI with HDCP. HDMI is optional, look DisplayPort. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Displayport Look at the supporters as well.

I think you failed to read through the first two pages to understand what that's a reference to (hint: it was a reference to the fact that no-one complained when HDMI ports were introduced on DVD players, which allowed them a new - optional - feature... just like all these new features are on the Blu Ray player).

Punishment: I e-smack you with a trout.

To invest in a HDM is like investing in a Bentley. Telling them you paid the premium to just watch a movie is telling that Bentley owner "it's just a car for transportation". We all know the simplicity of what we buy but we pay a premium for the creature comforts and added luxuries not found with traditional standards.
So please don't insult people by telling them they paid the premium to "just watch a movie". They deserve better then that!

Telling people "You paid for a player that will allow you to watch movies in HD with better sound than ever (that's thin, the sound thing... but there are new HD sound formats for whatever reason) with more room for special features" is not to be confused with "you bought this just to watch a movie".

I really can't get over how much it bothers me that people are actually whining that the player they bought - knowing what it can and can't do beforehand - can't play the new feature which the company just came out with. So they decided to come out with *new* features? Does that limit the product you bought from being able to perform what you bought it to do? NO. IMO you should get on your knees and thank Sony for offering the new format war winner advanced features so as to better protect your investment in BR discs.

<Note: I also hate Sony and take neither side... the fact that Sony decided to value-add to a product after it seems to have won in the last few days/weeks is a move I wouldn't have expected from them, but it's actually nice to see them do it for a change>

[STEvil]

HDDVD and BluRay can go screw each other and produce bastard children for all I care.

[tiro_uspsss]

Punishment: I e-smack you with a trout.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[oohms]

I don't see how its that bad... Sure current owners of blu-ray drives get screwed, but that's what you get for being an early adopter..
I'm just happy the format war is almost over and the higher capacity disk won (with its awesome coating)
Not to mention that all this DRM stuff will just get cracked again... like it always does :rolleyes:

The only thing im worried about is the cost of the media.

[Decami]

I think you failed to read through the first two pages to understand what that's a reference to (hint: it was a reference to the fact that no-one complained when HDMI ports were introduced on DVD players, which allowed them a new - optional - feature... just like all these new features are on the Blu Ray player).

Punishment: I e-smack you with a trout.



Telling people "You paid for a player that will allow you to watch movies in HD with better sound than ever (that's thin, the sound thing... but there are new HD sound formats for whatever reason) with more room for special features" is not to be confused with "you bought this just to watch a movie".

I really can't get over how much it bothers me that people are actually whining that the player they bought - knowing what it can and can't do beforehand - can't play the new feature which the company just came out with. So they decided to come out with *new* features? Does that limit the product you bought from being able to perform what you bought it to do? NO. IMO you should get on your knees and thank Sony for offering the new format war winner advanced features so as to better protect your investment in BR discs.

<Note: I also hate Sony and take neither side... the fact that Sony decided to value-add to a product after it seems to have won in the last few days/weeks is a move I wouldn't have expected from them, but it's actually nice to see them do it for a change>

Seriously. Its like buying a Core2 back when it was just B3 and throwing a fit when G0 released cause others are running cooler that bought one later than you. Its ridiculous.

[Cobalt]

Serra is still getting HDMI and HDCP confused. HDMI is an interface and is optional in the same way that any interface is. My first DVD player didn't have a DVI output a later player I bought did. Neither of those players had HDMI, my current one does. But it didn't matter wether I used HDMI, VGA, SCART, composite or component, when I watched the DVD I still got all the features (at varying levels of IQ :P). HDCP is feature limiting but doesn't really apply to DVDs.

Despite all of that you still haven't given a reason why Blu-ray is actually better, you've just made flailing rebuttals to any reason why it might be bad. From a consumer point of view HD-DVD is better for pretty much the same reasons VHS was better than betamax; a slight increase in quality isn't worth the difference in price. Especially when the difference in price is due to features that most current users won't have access to.

The crucial difference in this format war is that consumers are no longer in control.

[nemrod]

Despite all of that you still haven't given a reason why Blu-ray is actually better,

DVD (single layer) / CD = 6.7
HDDVD / DVD (single layer) = 3.2
Bluray (single layer) / DVD (single layer) = 5.3

I prefer the bluray for the future for storage.

HDDVD region free are you really sure this is a permanent reality? http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/05/30/HD-DVD_will_now_implement_region_coding/

Difference in price? What do you mean? Player? It's just a matter of time, like always. Just actual price? the looser is ready to lose money today to try to gain more tomorrow... Media price?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000W7GFG4/ref=pd_cp_d_2?pf_rd_p=316286001&pf_rd_s=center-41&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B000Q6ZG5M&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=097AC6J4DQSKAWCZG7YA
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000W7F50Q/ref=pd_cp_d_1?pf_rd_p=316286001&pf_rd_s=center-41&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B000W45D06&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=02BX3TD4X4TTZN1N78WR

or
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000MRAAJM/ref=amb_link_4566342_2?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=special-offers-1&pf_rd_r=04P1HT72B0JAQVBCSS0K&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=328773901&pf_rd_i=B000MRAAJW
http://www.amazon.com/Planet-Earth-Complete-BBC-DVD/dp/B000MRAAJW/ref=pd_ts_c_th_1?pf_rd_p=344210401&pf_rd_s=right-4&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_i=193642011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=05NRE3VES7FP2YV18Z20

In fact seen no real argument to hddvd... Most are just sony =bad, sony rootkit blabla... But in fact bluray isn't just sony, behind bluray, there is a lot country involved for my point of view at least some european industries, behind hddvd, it's just american. I prefer the format where most countries are involved, than just one... :shrug:

And for the sony rootkit, it was bad, but it was very strange that russinovich has always hurt bad foreign (Sony, Daemon Tools) but be very nice with US one (microsoft, symantec, starforce...). Obviously, I will not do any comment on the integrity of this guy to have hurt sony, and to be now employed by ms...

[Kingcarcas]

I would not even care if i bought a stand alone instead of a PS3. From what i've seen it's the ability to see director commentary and other crap at the same time as i'm watching the movie. 2.0 allows you to go online and download some extra useless crap
*goes to check mailbox for Halloween BD*

[Eastcoasthandle]

The problem I've had with BR is:
A. PQ on some movies are questionable
B. Lack of Creativity
C. Lack of innovation

A. PQ
5th Element (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=10976524&postcount=5)
POTC:COBP (http://www.homotron.net/2007/12/potc_the_curse_of_the_black_pe.html) which can be exchanged now
Total Recall (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=10790363&postcount=1)
Scary Movie (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=930256)
Spiderman 1 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12032172&postcount=20)
Spiderman 2 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12026409&postcount=3)
etc, etc


B. Lack of Creativity
The BR players plays no different the DVD.
Besides the fact that to date, profile 1.1 players cannot produce sound for both PiP and the movie at the same time (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12776411&postcount=1). It's either one or the other, even though you can have PiP on the screen. I haven't heard news about profile 1.1 movies yet (Resident Evil and SunShine). So, if I want a movie that doesn't have profile 1.1 I'm stuck with DVD quality features. :shakes:


C. Lack of Innovation
If you go with BR you will have to pick between a few different sticker'd titles:
No sticker = I assume you can use any BR player
Bonus View = Profile 1.1
BD Live = Profile 2.0
Lets hope that I want a movie that matches the features I want. This is simply confusing!


I went from the Sony booth where they were tooting BD Live and the still unscheduled 2.0 profile (in some cases with the Godzilla director there to show it off himself). And when you get to the their actual demo of BD live what was the big, great feature (really the ONLY feature they had to show)? A downloadable Godzilla ring tone for your cell phone! Are you kidding? Apparently not. It was really depressing. And I pushed the reps on the details but they had very little else they could offer. I was hoping for “this is just the tip of the iceberg and here are some of the other great things it will do” but all they could show was “and here is where you could register the disc online or join an email list, etc. Really, really lame… And the interface still looked terrible. And it totally removed you from the movie – all the content was its own screens that froze the movie and dropped the sound. I asked if they would have BD Live features that were able to play WITH the movie and were integrated to its time code and they said nothing currently was in the works, “but anything is possible.” They didn’t seem to “get it” at all. (Oh, they also showed how they would be able to update the trailers you see with a film over time, as if this was a great feature for consumers! I couldn’t help but point out that they can’t manage to get more than a token set of trailers on the PS Networks so I’m not holding my breadth on this…)
Source (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12746915&postcount=1)

These are reasons why I stop buying BR. It makes no sense to pay a premium and not get it.
:up: