View Full Version : ~$450+ budget cooling solution
sickpuppy
06-11-2007, 05:29 AM
I want to build a sub ambient cooled, highly overclocked core2duo rig by the end of the month. I also want to cool other components in the system. Please correct any misconceptions I may have, and provide suggestions.
1-I was considering a high end water loop with a MCW6500. I need a beefy radiator and came across Thermochill PA120.3 is well over $135. For about the same price as the Thermochill i can get 2x DD Black Ice 360's (older models) and the extra fans required. Would I be better off using two cheaper radiators or the single Thermochill? (I have to pick a case based on this)
2-I was not considering phase change since it is cost prohibitive, difficult to make myself, and would only cool the processor. My goal is to get sub ambient, not sub zero at load.
3-Chillers always seem to be huge and bulky, and look like you broke something open and stuck it to a cooler. I prefer a more finished look. If i could get a used chiller that doesn't look like it came from Mad Max, that is within my budget, I would consider it. The power consumption would probably be better too. (I wont have access to the classifieds any time soon, after 7 years of being a [H] member i only have 430 posts)
What do you guys think?
jimmyz
06-11-2007, 05:51 AM
with the info given i would say look at tec cooling. you could probably build a nice cooling set-up for 450, and without the home-made look.
HiJon89
06-11-2007, 06:19 AM
The MCW6500 seems like a good choice for you, and I agree with your decision to not go with a PA120.3, but I would stay away from the Black Ice 360's. In your case 2x Swiftech MCR320's would be cheaper and cool much better.
When you say you want to cool more than just your CPU, do you mean you want to put a TEC block on your GPU as well? Or do you mean you just want to do straight water cooling on the GPU and NB in addition to TEC on CPU?
sickpuppy
06-11-2007, 06:45 AM
Straight water on the NB and video card would be sufficient. I would start with one video card, and perhaps add a second identical card when the performance is waning. Currently i have the 8800series in mind, not sure which one exactly.
If I cool NB+Video, where is it best to place the blocks... before or after the processor? I would guess before since the dT post processor would be very low and not cool effectively... but I can worry about that later.
If you are curious as to exactly what I have in mind, the link to the intended build is in my profile just go to my website and click on the link at the bottom to "more pictures" and it has the intended specs for the new system.
HiJon89
06-11-2007, 06:58 AM
It really doesn't matter very much which order things go in the loop. The water temp at any point in the loop doesn't vary by more than a few degrees. It would be better to keep the tubing as short as possible, rather than worrying about a specific order. For you I would recommend (All prices quoted from PetrasTechShop.com):
MCW6500 on the CPU - $160
MCW60 on the GPU - $50
MCW30 on the NB - $30
2x MCR320 Radiators - $110
DDC2 w/ Petra Top - $100
------------------------
Total: $450
Add tubing and other assorted items and you're a little over budget, but you have one hell of a cooling setup.
littleowl
06-11-2007, 09:14 AM
or save your self some and get a very good pump like this (http://www.petrastechshop.com/lad5smcin12v.html)
I for one don't care for the ddc pumps. Why not just get a SS and then water cool the video and NB?
Maybe because the D5 only has 11 feet of head?
n00b 0f l337
06-11-2007, 12:08 PM
Head isn't everything.
littleowl
06-11-2007, 12:25 PM
Maybe because the D5 only has 11 feet of head?
No
I like the D5 because they are reliable as I have seen several ddc just die and kill cpu and other stuff.
Also they use the same D5 pump in some washers for the drain pump.
sickpuppy
06-11-2007, 04:23 PM
By n00b 0f l337: "Head isn't everything."
What is head? I am not filling my loop with beer. ^^ Didn't work too well last time, my friends decided to drink it and... well lets not go there.
By littleOwl: "Why not just get a SS and then water cool the video and NB?"
get a SS?
Regarding the pump:
I have heard good things about the MCP655 and have seen it in several people's high end setups. I honestly cant tell the difference from reading peoples comments when it comes to "which top end items are better and why"
Those debates tend to become: "a tale of two fanboys"
Can both of those pumps handle (2)radiator/CPU/NB/(2)GPU and stay reliable?
Movieman
06-11-2007, 04:25 PM
Head isn't everything.
Can I sig this?:rofl:
sickpuppy
06-11-2007, 04:28 PM
I didn't want to go there since I am new. Thank you for not letting that comment go to waste.
Movieman
06-11-2007, 04:30 PM
I didn't want to go there since I am new. Thank you for not letting that comment go to waste.
I knew I wasn't the only one with his mind in the gutter but he set himself up sooooo good!:ROTF:
Higher head is used to overcome Restriction of a water cooling loop.
Restriction like the radiator, waterblocks. Since you might be using a couple of Radiators that flow might turn to a trickle if you don't have enough head.
Though we should wait for a more... well a higher Authority.
I've always been told Head height is more important than flow rate.
Edit: Speak of the Devil Movieman ;)
n00b 0f l337
06-11-2007, 04:35 PM
Damn sig it, fine I set myself up for that, but it is true in every sense ;)
sickpuppy
06-11-2007, 04:36 PM
Edit: Speak of the Devil Movieman ;)
Is that devilman? ^^
Anyways doesn't more head mean more flowrate? Or just how much resistance it can overcome... kindof like torque and horsepower are different...
Yes its just about overcoming resistance.
If you were to get lets say... hypothetically get a pump that dished out max 10 feet of head and max 5 GPM. And the resistance of the loop is great enough to restrict greater than the max 10 feet of head you are not going to get the max 5 GPM. In most cases it'll quickly become a trickle exponentially with higher restriction. You can see this with some waterblocks like the G4 Storm and having a couple of radiators.
However if you get a pump that gives a max 21 feet of head with max 2 GPM it'll probably run at 2 GPM in the loop you are proposing. Most setups only need 2 GPM anyway, so Head height is more favorable.
littleowl
06-12-2007, 04:37 AM
By n00b 0f l337: "Head isn't everything."
What is head? I am not filling my loop with beer. ^^ Didn't work too well last time, my friends decided to drink it and... well lets not go there.
By littleOwl: "Why not just get a SS and then water cool the video and NB?"
get a SS?
Regarding the pump:
I have heard good things about the MCP655 and have seen it in several people's high end setups. I honestly cant tell the difference from reading peoples comments when it comes to "which top end items are better and why"
Those debates tend to become: "a tale of two fanboys"
Can both of those pumps handle (2)radiator/CPU/NB/(2)GPU and stay reliable?
I have no idea on the ddc-2 with the petra top but the first ddc can not handle your loop. I couldn't get it through my loop. I got a ddc and had not even a trickle with it (do to the head) I have also seen several people with dead systems that have used the ddc pumps. That is not to say that the ddc-2 is not a good pump but I have not seen the d5 fail yet. :)
I didn't want to go there since I am new. Thank you for not letting that comment go to waste.
just go there and have fun. MM is a horny old man. :D We love him in the DC section though. On a side note Dave is a little devil
Damn sig it, fine I set myself up for that, but it is true in every sense ;)
Yes you set yourself up for that one NOL. :D I was going to be nice and not say a word about it.
Movieman
06-12-2007, 11:40 AM
MM is a horny old man. :D We love him in the DC section though. On a side note Dave is a little devil
Who me?:shrug:
Nah, just a front I put up to try and keep up with all you young guys!:D
newls1
06-12-2007, 01:38 PM
Can I sig this?:rofl:
ROFL:yepp:
I want to build a sub ambient cooled, highly overclocked core2duo rig by the end of the month. I also want to cool other components in the system. Please correct any misconceptions I may have, and provide suggestions.
1-I was considering a high end water loop with a MCW6500. I need a beefy radiator and came across Thermochill PA120.3 is well over $135. For about the same price as the Thermochill i can get 2x DD Black Ice 360's (older models) and the extra fans required. Would I be better off using two cheaper radiators or the single Thermochill? (I have to pick a case based on this)
2-I was not considering phase change since it is cost prohibitive, difficult to make myself, and would only cool the processor. My goal is to get sub ambient, not sub zero at load.
3-Chillers always seem to be huge and bulky, and look like you broke something open and stuck it to a cooler. I prefer a more finished look. If i could get a used chiller that doesn't look like it came from Mad Max, that is within my budget, I would consider it. The power consumption would probably be better too. (I wont have access to the classifieds any time soon, after 7 years of being a [H] member i only have 430 posts)
What do you guys think?
I noticed you don't seem to like chillers, let me hit you up with this idea. The lian li v2000b costs about $200, and has a GIANT lower bay that many people use for housing phases and chillers as they fit without a problem. And then you can add sound dampening to that section by itself for under $20, so you'd have a silent bay for a chiller. And finally building a chiller itself truly doesn't cost too much. But if you don't feel comfertable I'm sure you could get a deal for someone to do it for around $200 if you tell them to perhaps reuse a few parts for a discount or getting cheaper ones
But if you don't like that idea, then I suggest you just go water without that tecs, check out some of the tec guides and you'll see how many hidden costs there are to tec cooling and how little performance gain you get for your money since if you plan to do direct die cooling then you can't run other things on the loop, and if you plan to cooler the water, you'll run into the issues the freezone has about not being able to handle load
ali
sickpuppy
06-12-2007, 07:49 PM
Let me go check out the chiller forum for internal to case chillers that look like a stock build ^^ not like a cooler with frosted tubes sticking out of it.
teyber
07-04-2007, 10:35 AM
I want to build a sub ambient cooled, highly overclocked core2duo rig by the end of the month. I also want to cool other components in the system. Please correct any misconceptions I may have, and provide suggestions.
1-I was considering a high end water loop with a MCW6500. I need a beefy radiator and came across Thermochill PA120.3 is well over $135. For about the same price as the Thermochill i can get 2x DD Black Ice 360's (older models) and the extra fans required. Would I be better off using two cheaper radiators or the single Thermochill? (I have to pick a case based on this)
2-I was not considering phase change since it is cost prohibitive, difficult to make myself, and would only cool the processor. My goal is to get sub ambient, not sub zero at load.
3-Chillers always seem to be huge and bulky, and look like you broke something open and stuck it to a cooler. I prefer a more finished look. If i could get a used chiller that doesn't look like it came from Mad Max, that is within my budget, I would consider it. The power consumption would probably be better too. (I wont have access to the classifieds any time soon, after 7 years of being a [H] member i only have 430 posts)
What do you guys think?
you should go with a phase change with that kind of money! 450 should get you a 1/3hp r507a ss!
kevinbo03
07-04-2007, 04:08 PM
you should go with a phase change with that kind of money! 450 should get you a 1/3hp r507a ss!
Only for the CPU though :(
hecktic
07-04-2007, 04:37 PM
It really doesn't matter very much which order things go in the loop. The water temp at any point in the loop doesn't vary by more than a few degrees. It would be better to keep the tubing as short as possible, rather than worrying about a specific order. For you I would recommend (All prices quoted from PetrasTechShop.com):
MCW6500 on the CPU - $160
MCW60 on the GPU - $50
MCW30 on the NB - $30
2x MCR320 Radiators - $110
DDC2 w/ Petra Top - $100
------------------------
Total: $450
Add tubing and other assorted items and you're a little over budget, but you have one hell of a cooling setup.
Add the AUX PSU now assuming your going to use dedicated amps....
entropy
07-14-2007, 09:29 AM
TECs are going to be more cost prohibitive in terms of perf/$ compared to custom chiller.
[XC] gomeler
07-14-2007, 01:59 PM
You can have a chiller made in a stainless steel single-stage case, have it sit under your PC and have the cold and hot water lines run through the bottom of your case or out the back of your case. It doesn't get more professional looking than that. A good chiller is slightly above your price range and it'll net you much better performance than a TEC setup as you can have the system built for many different temperature ranges.