View Full Version : R12 vs R290
SexyMF
03-14-2007, 01:32 AM
Would I achieve more capacity from R12 over Propane?
I would be slightly happier not having a flammable gas in the system.
johann
03-14-2007, 01:41 AM
R12 is seriously bad for the environment, its weird that it has not been banned in your country.
{.bLanK} GoD
03-14-2007, 03:03 AM
As far as I know (so not for sure) it is not illegal to "use" r12 or any other CFC gas here in NZ. But importation is restricted to exempt use only.
I will ask the engineer tomorrow.
I know R12 is a good refrigerant, and some people do still have a bit kickin around.
As far as I know (so not for sure) it is not illegal to "use" r12 or any other CFC gas here in NZ. But importation is restricted to exempt use only.
I will ask the engineer tomorrow.
I know R12 is a good refrigerant, and some people do still have a bit kickin around.
i dont think ya can buy it aus, but if you reclaim some you could reuse it.
to memory remember someone saying its 20x worse than r22.
star882
03-14-2007, 06:45 AM
It performs about the same as R134a. R22 is better.
[XC] gomeler
03-14-2007, 09:25 AM
Just go with r290 or r22, r12 is evil.
[XC] MarioMaster
03-14-2007, 09:46 AM
^agree - r12 isn't great for cooling and it's a lot worse for the environment
Exahertz
03-14-2007, 09:58 AM
r12 is evil.
:devil: :upset: :devil: :upset: :devil: :upset: lol
SexyMF
03-14-2007, 11:14 AM
OK, how does R22 compare to R290 capacity wise
aasmaukr
03-14-2007, 11:23 AM
R22 beats R290 at capacity and has 1,3*C higher boiling point I think. Stay away from R12, there are good alternatives :).
OK, how does R22 compare to R290 capacity wise
Do you really WANT to use CFC?
Exahertz
03-14-2007, 11:53 AM
Do you really WANT to use CFC?
r22 is HCFC and r290 is H-carbon
SexyMF
03-14-2007, 12:01 PM
I'm just probing as to the gases I have access too.
Exahertz
03-14-2007, 12:13 PM
www.epatest.com
take 608 and you have access to them all ;) most places will sell even if your not certified, its all about the $$$
SexyMF
03-14-2007, 08:12 PM
www.epatest.com
take 608 and you have access to them all ;) most places will sell even if your not certified, its all about the $$$
Good idea, but I'm not USA or needing to purchase R22 or R12.
{.bLanK} GoD
03-14-2007, 09:14 PM
You don't need a license to purchase refrigerant here.
And it is legal to use R12. You just can't buy it anywhere.
And yeah, it's fully evil.
R402a, R507a, R404a, R134a are the gases that are easily available here.
R402a is the best performing but most expensive. Not sure how much exactly.
R507a I can get for about $30Kg
R404a, $25ish per Kg
R134a is quiet a bit cheaper than all of them
SexyMF
03-15-2007, 12:15 AM
I work next to a BOC gas outlet. They won't sell me anything (except 134a) unless I'm licensed. Nor will Realcold (refrigeration engineering)
wdrzal
03-15-2007, 01:08 AM
www.epatest.com
take 608 and you have access to them all ;) most places will sell even if your not certified, its all about the $$$
Only if you have a type 1 or 2 and type 3 ......... minds well have a universal all 3..608 types.
you can't buy certian gases unless you have type 3
wdrzal
03-15-2007, 01:14 AM
go with r22 if you can get it,high capacity,non flammable ,cheapest gas you will get........Temp about same as propane.
SexyMF
03-15-2007, 03:19 AM
atm clocking higher than 3.6V is requiring ~1.5Vcore and under orthos the evap is slowly but surely heating up. So rather than more gas and insane pressures I'd like some more heat shifting capacity. My condensor can certainly handle it.
SexyMF
03-15-2007, 03:19 AM
R22 will drop in to my NL11F?
{.bLanK} GoD
03-15-2007, 03:51 AM
R22 is being phased out here over the next few years.
Won't be able to buy it soon.
I did offer to help out:shrug:
Revv23
03-15-2007, 09:21 AM
can you use R22 with mineral oil?
wdrzal
03-15-2007, 10:08 AM
R22 is being phased out here over the next few years.
Won't be able to buy it soon.
I did offer to help out:shrug:
the truth:
Phaseout Schedule for HCFCs Including R-22
Under the terms of the Montreal Protocol, the U.S. agreed to meet certain obligations by specific dates that will affect the residential heat pump and air-conditioning industry:
January 1, 2004:
In accordance with the terms of the Montreal Protocol, the amount of all HCFCs that can be produced nationwide must be reduced by 35% by 2004. In order to achieve this goal, the U.S. is ceasing production of HCFC-141b, the most ozone-damaging of this class of chemicals, on January 1, 2003. This production ban will greatly reduce nationwide use of HCFCs as a group, making it likely that the 2004 deadline will have a minimal effect on R-22 supplies.
January 1, 2010:
After 2010, chemical manufacturers may still produce R-22 to service existing equipment, but not for use in new equipment. As a result, heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC) system manufacturers will only be able to use pre-existing supplies of R-22 to produce new air conditioners and heat pumps. These existing supplies would include R-22 recovered from existing equipment and recycled.
January 1, 2020:
Use of existing refrigerant, including refrigerant that has been recovered and recycled, will be allowed beyond 2020 to service existing systems, but chemical manufacturers will no longer be able to produce R-22 to service existing air conditioners and heat pumps.
star882
03-15-2007, 11:40 AM
can you use R22 with mineral oil?
R22 is designed to be used with mineral oil or alkylbenzene. I think alkylbenzene is better for CPU coolers as it flows better. But R22 is compatible with all 3 common types of refrigeration oils.
SexyMF
03-15-2007, 10:34 PM
Yes, nice refrigerant, it's fine with POE. What is your cap tube?
Around 2.5m of .031"