Max FSB Epox8RGA+ ?

[TheDude]

I have an Epox 8RGA+ cooled by PhaseChange with XP1700cpu. First problem is I cannot use any multi except 11x. 2nd problem is max fsb is 215. It also becomes unstable with any vcore over 1.7. My VDD = 2.0 VDIMM = 2.9 VAGP = 1.8 Timings are 5222....anyone else running this board?

[TheDude]

Anyone have any ideas? Do I have to mod my cpu? Thought I would have all mutiplyers available like on my NF7-S. I just read a MadShrimp review and they only got 220 fsb.

[XtremepH]

well i had a Epox 8RGA+ that could only managed 212FSB stable but would boot into Windows as high 230FSB but just wasn't stable at anything above 212. So I decided to replace mines with a NF7-S 2.0 which will be arriving tommorrow.

[twiztdskatr]

EPoX SuX ;)

Go get an Intel, you will be pleased :D

[Holst]

What bios are you running Dude?

Check your northbridge cooling first.

Then you may have to mod the Vreg to disable the OCP (lift pin 16 If i remember correctly, check the Vmods section to be sure)

WHat graphics card?

The board I ran did 225 no problems with my winbond.

[XtremepH]

Holst was your board modded?

[BrainStorm]

Dude, I am assuming you tried all the lower voltages first and they didn't work either, cause sometimes less is more. :D

What stepping is the NB and how are you cooling it? Are you cooling the SB?

Have yo done anything about cooling the mosfets to the left of the cpu?

What about cooling for the vr chip near the chip that you used to need to mod on the 8RDA for vdd?

You could try removing the 100/133/166 jumper from the board, but I think that only helps with 166 fsb cpus.

Just some ideas.

[adamginz15]

My 8RGA+ Is great
it does up to 202 on VDD 1.6
the it does up to 216 on VDD 1.8
and then up to 227 on VDD 2

[BrainStorm]

MCWB has one and his sig says he's doing 218 (with a very early version of the board), and donny_paycheck is now at 220 after we straightened out his problem (taking off the jumper on board because he had a 2600)

BTW, with respect to the multis, I'm sorry, but I don't know what's up with that. My 8RDA will give me 12.5 and below on a 1700+

[MCWB]

Yup mine does 218 dual channel 2-3-2-2 rock solid stable, can Prime/Fold all day. :) In single channel I can get up to 225 MHz 3D Markable. This is with 2.0 Vdd (waterblock on NB), 2.9 Vdimm, 2.1 Vcore. :)

With respect to the Vcore problem, I could not use any Vcore over 1.95 V without it blackscreening on me. I then put a small ramsink on the core voltage regulator and now I can use up to 2.2 V Primeable, no problems (2.15 V is about the limit my classic vapo can take though). :) 1.7 V is very low for this to be a problem, it could be that your chip simply doesn't like voltage (some of them don't).

The multi problem is weird... :confused:

[CCW]

Originally posted by MCWB

The multi problem is weird... :confused:

Have to blow the bridges on CPU to get mults higher than 13.

Craig

[TheDude]

Ok....I am cooling both NB and SB with chilled water. They are VERY cold. I will look into cooling the other things mentioned above (thanks).
I hesitate to blow the bridges as some of you can access other multis without doing this.
NB is A1 stepping...if I remember right
Video card is ChainTech GeForce ti4600
I already removed the 100/133/166 jumper from the board...maybe I should put it back?
May mod the Vreg to disable the OCP...will look into it.
I had this chip at higher volts...all the way to 2.8 in another setup at 15x
Thanks for all the good suggestions guys...gave me lots to try!
:D

[EdgarBaba]

http://www.motherboardfaqs.com/Epox_nForce2/file.php?file=vcore_shutoff_mod.htm - done this mod??? maybe it can fix your vcore probs...

[MCWB]

Originally posted by CCW
Have to blow the bridges on CPU to get mults higher than 13.Sure, but he can't use any multiplier other than 11X apparantly, which is indeed weird! :D

[Holst]

Originally posted by XtremepH
Holst was your board modded?

Nope, my 8rga+ was totaly stock even cooling was.
The only modded boards I have ATM are my 8rda+ and my 8KHA+ (the 8k3a+ burned up :( )

If your having multiplyer problems dude try changing CPU interface to Agressive (or back to optimal)

It might also be worth trying other bios, try the latest one and also the one closest too 3305 (may fifth)

[BrainStorm]

Dude, I'd also try putting the jumper back on to 100/133 and see if that helps with the multi problem.

Also, on the NB stepping, was the NB completely black rather than having the silver circle in the middle...if so, then you at least have the Crush-18D...latest and greatest.

See pic of Crush 18-D:
http://mysite.verizon.net/res02y6d/crush18-d.jpg

[TheDude]

Thanks very much for the suggestions. I am looking into all of them. :D

[BrainStorm]

Also, for thermal images to help you decide about cooling, check out the thermal images this guy has posted:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/bubo/index.html

They are of an 8RDA+, but the 8RGA+ board layout is the same AFAIK.

[TheDude]

BrainStorm,

Very "cool" pics!

Thanks :D

[TheDude]

Ok...so far I added a hs to Vreg (have not cut trace yet)
added a fan blowing on Vreg area
replaced 100/133/166 pin on 133/166 setting
Have multiplers of 11 and below now..changed it to 10.5
and now am at:

[TheDude]

Well for now I'm stuck at 222fsb..will not go 1mhz higher, but vcore is still stuck at 1.7....so I guess cutting the trace and bridge on cpu is next.
Thanks guys....I would not have gotten this far without you! :D

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by TheDude
replaced 100/133/166 pin on 133/166 setting
Have multiplers of 11 and below now..changed it to 10.5
and now am at:

Dude, I'd try putting it on the 100/133 setting...hopefully should give you 12.5 and below on the multis.

[TheDude]

Originally posted by BrainStorm
Dude, I'd try putting it on the 100/133 setting...hopefully should give you 12.5 and below on the multis.

hmmmm....ok...now have 12x for the 1st time! Funny thing is..I had it on 100/133 when this whole thing started and only multi I had was 11...I believe in logic, not magic! I feel like I'm driving on the wrong side of the road in the Epox bios, I am so used to Abit. I don't know why it wouldn't work before and does now...but I will take it. :D
Now I still need to cut the 5th L3 to get 13x and above? Not like my Abit?

[BrainStorm]

Yeah, that is very strange. :confused:

As far as which bridge to mess with, I'd check candjac's stuff:

http://www.beachlink.com/candjac/index.htm

EDIT: Yeah, per candjac, you have to open the 5th L3 bridge. But you're not going to do that before you get the cpu voltage problem cleared up, right? Also, make sure you read through the "experiences" part of candjac's dsissertation...looks like this mod is not necessarily w/o its share of problems!!!

[glock19owner]

Originally posted by TheDude
hmmmm....ok...now have 12x for the 1st time! Funny thing is..I had it on 100/133 when this whole thing started and only multi I had was 11...I believe in logic, not magic! I feel like I'm driving on the wrong side of the road in the Epox bios, I am so used to Abit. I don't know why it wouldn't work before and does now...but I will take it. :D
Now I still need to cut the 5th L3 to get 13x and above? Not like my Abit?

Blowing just the 5th bridge will give you 13x only...to fully utilize the 13x and higher multiplier you will have to blow the 3rd and 5th bridge on the L3...or be safer and do like I did...and just close them like you did on the L1 birdges on the Pali's...that way if you ever put it back into the Abit all you will have to do is clean the bridges off and have all of the multipliers again on the abit...

[TheDude]

after I try cutting the trace...if that doesn't work there's not much sense in upping the multi...no voltage

I can only get 198x12...need more cpu volts..plus my NB and SB want to freeze up..need the heat too!

[BrainStorm]

Dude, did you see my edit to my other post about cutting that it isn't always trouble-free? Also, I'm still surprised you don't have 12.5x, which would at least get you to 2775 if you can solve your voltage problem.

[TheDude]

I do have 12.5....you are right..I will skip the cpu mod but still need more cpu voltage. In Abit board the chip took high volts, so it's not the cpu...has to be the board. I think I will stick with Abit from now on...still has bugs but they are bugs I know. :D

[BrainStorm]

OK...time to read up on the mod you need :D

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8344&highlight=8rda+overvoltage+mod%2A

or also

http://www.8rdafaq.com/Epox_nForce2/file.php?file=vcore_shutoff_mod.htm

These are for the 8RDA+, but I think will work for the 8RGA+ as well, but you'd better check and make sure the chips and traces are the same.

EDIT: BTW, you are also using the little 12v PIV style power connector, right?

[TheDude]

EDIT: BTW, you are also using the little 12v PIV style power connector, right?

yeppers....thanks for the links Bro! :D

I know where and how to do the mod, but probably gonna have to pull the board to get to it with mag glass and exacto. ;)

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by TheDude
yeppers....thanks for the links Bro! :D

I know where and how to do the mod, but probably gonna have to pull the board to get to it with mag glass and exacto. ;)

NP ;) Let us know how the mod goes...looks to be pretty simple, really. Hope it works. The article at 8RDAfaq leaves out the third alternative...there is a trace you can cut between pin 16 on the VR chip and the appropriate resistor.

EDIT: Guess it looks like that's what you're going for. :D

[TheDude]

Yeah....I found it...tried to cut it just powering off and unplugging...but I don't think I can see it well enough. I hate to tear this whole thing apart again, but may have to.:mad:

[BrainStorm]

Yeah, I imagine it's a PITA, but that kind of detail work seems like something you'd best do in an open, well-lit area. You'd hate to screw up and cut more than you need, or the wrong place entirely.

[adamginz15]

Can i ask how did u fix the multi problem?
my multi will only do 11 and 10 , no halfs!
cant do 10.5 and 11.5 and 12.5
its just clearing up cmos.

[TheDude]

Originally posted by adamginz15
Can i ask how did u fix the multi problem?
my multi will only do 11 and 10 , no halfs!
cant do 10.5 and 11.5 and 12.5
its just clearing up cmos.

I wish I knew for sure...here's the changes that I made that resulted in access to 12.5 and below ( I had only 11x at 1st)
1) make sure the jumper is set to 100/133 on mobo
2) added hs to Vreg and a fan blowing over that entire area
That's the only differences...all of a sudden I have the multis. Biggest thing was the jumper pin.
If it doesn't take the half multi...reset it and try several times...it took me several attempts before it stopped reverting to default settings to boot and actually accepted mine.
Next I will cut the Vreg trace in hopes of higher vcore than 1.7.

[adamginz15]

sorry for asking but what is the Vreg ?
and what u mean by reseting (reseting what?) it copule of time?

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by adamginz15
sorry for asking but what is the Vreg ?
and what u mean by reseting (reseting what?) it copule of time?

He means the voltage regulation chip located above the mosfets to the left of the CPU.

By resetting, he means just change multiplier to the value you want in the BIOS and save. He just had to do it several times before it took.

[adamginz15]

by cooling it , it can take any affect?
is it a chip that is getting very hot , that needs passive cooling?

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by adamginz15
by cooling it , it can take any affect?
is it a chip that is getting very hot , that needs passive cooling?

I've attached a pic with the chip he's talking about circled. You can try touching your's when it's running to see how hot it gets. But probably fairly warm..so don't touch too long :D He also has a fan blowing on the mosfets underneath it. I personally have a HS on both the vr chip and all the mosfets.

[BrainStorm]

Here's a pic of my mobo showing my heatsinking of the chips. If I had it to do again, I'd make individual heatsinks for each mosfet to ensure optimal contact with each chip.

[adamginz15]

ok
tnx alot
i will try it tomorrow.
on the mofests i got active cooling a fan blowing wind on there.

[BrainStorm]

If you have a fan blowing on the mosfets, the vr chip is probably getting some cooling benefit from that already.

[adamginz15]

i guess so ...
because it really bothers me that i cant 10.5 my multi and 11.5 and 12.5 and every other half multi.
because my 8rga+ is really good for oc it does 215 on 1.8 no problem but the problem is that its or 2150 or somthing very high.

[TheDude]

Brainstorm,

Thanks for the pic, I am going to add seperate little heat sinks on each mosfet like you suggested. I bought a bag of 50 on Ebay. :D

adamginz15,

I don't know the answer as to why you don't get the 1/2 multiplyers. It is as strange as the problem I had with only having the 11x available...after a while it seemed to heal itself!

[JeffPH]

Brain, what HSF is that on your NB? from a P4 or P3?

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by JeffPH
Brain, what HSF is that on your NB? from a P4 or P3?

P3...works very well. Of course, I hope I never have to try and rma the board. It's AS epoxied on and I don't think it's coming off without the NB with it :D

[adamginz15]

adamginz15,

I don't know the answer as to why you don't get the 1/2 multiplyers. It is as strange as the problem I had with only having the 11x available...after a while it seemed to heal itself! [/B]


Well how much time it took its self to heal up???
how much time u tried to post before working on somthing that is other then the 11 multi.
i mean how many boots did u do before?
and if now its work all the time even if u change it?

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by TheDude
Thanks for the pic, I am going to add seperate little heat sinks on each mosfet like you suggested. I bought a bag of 50 on Ebay. :D

Dude, another thing...I don't know how high you plan on running your vdd, but if you go with 2v, you probably want to put a small hs on the vdd vr chip. I've seen a few pics where that chip gave up the ghost after a few months of running at 2v. I'll see about digging up a link.

I've attached a pic with the chip I'm talking about circled in yellow.

EDIT: Dude, check this thread starting with post #40:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10108&highlight=8RGA+chip

[twiztdskatr]

This is a whole lot of work for an 8RGA+ :confused: The onboard video is disabled i suppose, that might be why the FSB isnt hitting that high...

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by twiztdskatr
This is a whole lot of work for an 8RGA+ :confused: The onboard video is disabled i suppose, that might be why the FSB isnt hitting that high...

Well, you could just do without them all and settle for 215 or so fsb...but where's the fun in that? :D

[TheDude]

Dude, another thing...I don't know how high you plan on running your vdd, but if you go with 2v, you probably want to put a small hs on the vdd vr chip. I've seen a few pics where that chip gave up the ghost after a few months of running at 2v.

Brainstorm,

Thanks, I will add a hs there as well...I am at 2.0 now...I was a lot higher until I realized it and turned it down. It is modded. :D
My board is different model and looks different..not sure of location.

You have been very helpful with this Brainstorm...thanks for your time, I appreciate it. :D

[JeffPH]

found your thread :) good luck

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by TheDude
Brainstorm,

Thanks, I will add a hs there as well...I am at 2.0 now...I was a lot higher until I realized it and turned it down. It is modded. :D
My board is different model and looks different..not sure of location.

You have been very helpful with this Brainstorm...thanks for your time, I appreciate it. :D

Dude, NP :). Got any pics of your board? The earlier 8RGA+s had pretty much the same board layout as my 8RDA. The 8RGA+ toasted vdd vr chip in the link I posted is in exactly the same place as mine. My pic just looks a bit different because I have a fixed resistor soldered in place on the vdd chip for my vdd mod. :D

I have heard of folks running vdd as high as 2.2, but that's getting pretty scary as far as I'm concerned. :eek: Seems like there will eventually be a point of diminishing returns where the risk of burning out a chip is greater than the minimal reward in terms of higher fsb.

[adamginz15]

plz can u answer my earlier question?

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by adamginz15
plz can u answer my earlier question?

Which earlier question, Adam? Assuming you are talking about trying to get the other multipliers, let's try this. First, let's try making sure that your cpu fsb select jumper is in the 100/133 position. Check that it is set per the pic below from the 8rga+ manual.

Then go into the bios and try setting your cpu multiplier at 10.5. Then save and exit. See if it sets the multiplier to 10.5. One easy way to tell is to let it boot into windows and check with wcpuid. It tells you what multiplier you are set at.

If it didn't set it to 10.5. Try going through the same process again a few more times and see if it works. I think TheDude said it took a few attempts before it worked. Just keep trying until you're sure it is not going to work. I'd say it probably won't work if it has not worked after about 5 attempts.

If it still doesn't work, I'd try clearing the cmos (which will set everything to default in the bios) and repeat the process again. I've also posted a pic of the 8rga+ manual page with instructions for clearing the cmos.

If all that doesn't work, I'd see if there is a newer bios version than the one you are running and try flashing to it.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

[BrainStorm]

Clear cmos instructions:

[BrainStorm]

BTW, according to motherboardfaqs.com, there are a couple of BIOS available for the 8RGA+. Note that the rather cryptic explanation of updates for the 2/25/2003 bios mentions "Change CPU frequency update method". This sounds like it may be addressing the problem you are having Adam.

Dude, what bios are you running? Might help you to flash, too.

Here are the bios update descriptions:

2/25/2003 (8RGA3225)
Update BPL 2.89
Change CPU frequency update method

2/12/2003 (8RGA3212)
Added show "Memory Dual Channel Enable" at Post, when memory used dual channel.
Changed VGA BIOS Boot Title.

[adamginz15]

i have downloaded the latest bios its a 05/05/03

[BrainStorm]

Where did you get that? In the US, there is only the 02/25/2003.

[adamginz15]

there is a site the is under the taiwan epox site:
http://www.epox-technik.de/

direct link:
http://www.epox-technik.de/techsupp/downloads_anzeige.asp

[BrainStorm]

That's the German site, isn't it? Which is interesting because I couldn't find that bios even at the Taiwanese site. Wonder if it's still a beta version?

Well, did you flash to it and did it work? Or were you already running it? If so, perhaps you should flash back to the 2/25/2003 bios and see if that helps.

[TheDude]

I'm going to flash to the May bios and try the other stuff...kinda taking a day off tweaking this board....moving stuff around in the basement today.
Frankly, I wish I had bought another Abit NF7-S V2.0. I won't be buying anything else until we move to 64 bits. :D
I wish there was a dual evap head Prommie out. I'd go duallie next....if I could afford it. :D

[BrainStorm]

Dude, a little variety is good for the soul...even if only to confirm that your first choice is still your first choice. :D

No doubt it is a lot of work to really tweak this board up right, but sometimes the sense of accomplishment from pushing a particular piece of hardware further than most can/have is more than just getting what everyone else gets out of the box. ;)

On the other hand, sometimes you just wish :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana: would work the way you want it to without f'ing with it! :D

[adamginz15]

my multi is still not going on to halfs
s$$$
thats dissapointing

[TheDude]

Originally posted by adamginz15
my multi is still not going on to halfs
s$$$
thats dissapointing

adamginz15,

Did you mod your cpu in any way? Maybe take it out and clean it up some...there may be something making contact between points or bridges on the cpu...causing your multiplyer problem.


Dude, a little variety is good for the soul...even if only to confirm that your first choice is still your first choice.

Brainstorm,
That's what I tell my wife, but she ain't buying it! :D

[adamginz15]

how it can be?
the cpu sits in a socket
so how can it get in while its attached together?

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by TheDude
Brainstorm,
That's what I tell my wife, but she ain't buying it! :D

I hear ya on that one ;)

[TheDude]

Originally posted by adamginz15
how it can be?
the cpu sits in a socket
so how can it get in while its attached together?

It would have had to have been that way when it was installed. I just thought that maybe something was shorting some contacts.

[BrainStorm]

So Dude, where did you end up with all this?

[TheDude]

LOL...I still have to break the rig down and cut the traces...will do it this weekend. It's a job. Plus I was thinking about replacing my 1700 with my 2700 in the chiller and crank down on it hard to see what it has.:D

[Tweaked!]

TDude, forget about the traces on the chip. Go here (http://www.ocinside.de/go_e.html?/html/workshop/pinmod/amd_pinmod.html) and do the pin mod by painting the traces in between the pins. I've been doing it this way and that methods rulez! I will never again do it by the bridges on the top of the chips.

[TheDude]

LOL....I posted a link to that in OC section...pretty cool.
I am trying not to mod cpu at all....thinking of putting my xp2700 (already modded to 133) in the Epox board...by cutting trace, I was talking about a trace on the mobo on the VR chip....scroll up to see that post...may fix random shut down problems on that mobo from OV protection...I can't keep a voltage on cpu over 1.7 :D

[BrainStorm]

Originally posted by TheDude
LOL...I still have to break the rig down and cut the traces...will do it this weekend. It's a job. Plus I was thinking about replacing my 1700 with my 2700 in the chiller and crank down on it hard to see what it has.:D

Sounds like fun. GL :D

[Tedinde]

got 2 8rga+'s here yesterday. All the mults work fine with stock and modded 1700+'s tried 5 total.

.

[saaya]

woa are you a reseller or what? :o

[TheDude]

All multis over 12.5 work? Why don't mine work without a mod?