Insulation guide

[Ssilencer]

First, the materials:
http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/a/1/a1e8febe.jpg
Dielectric grease; acrilic Conforming Spray (PL2); varnish and Artic Ceramique, because it is the best for low temps.

Secondly, an insulator that prevents the air passage, as armaflex or even better, neoprene

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/0/a/0a3b3b66.jpg




We start with the motherboard, first with the back, clean it before, then apply a layer of conforming spray (pl2)
I preffer to do it over the whole mobo, just for extra precaution.


http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/9/b/9b420a9f.jpg

We let it dry and we applied a second layer,it has to be applied at 30cm away from the mobo, in a well ventilated place


http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/6/b/6bba138e.jpg


Once it's dry, we go with the front part of the motherboard
First, apply a varnish coat around the socket (NOT OVER THE SOCKET, OR WE WILL HAVE A DEAD MOBO)


http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/c/6/c6d1b317.jpg
http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/e/5/e5a013ee.jpg

Let it dry for 10 minutes, you can speed up with a hair dryer.




Ok, now it's time for the dielectric grease, (I use Dow corning compound 4)

Apply gently over the socket in both positions, open and closed with your fingers


http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/c/4/c48992de.jpg

Then, you can apply it also around the socket, over the varnish, maybe overkill, but I never had probs with condensation this way

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/9/e/9e4b8137.jpg
http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/6/e/6ed3fb90.jpg



Now leave your local insulator profesional give you the thumbs up :)

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/8/9/89d759f7.jpg


he saids it is ok, we can keep working now


Again, apply some dielectric grease over the conformal coating spray behind the socket.

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/2/b/2b510426.jpg
http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/e/9/e920f6c9.jpg


ok, now cover it with a piece of armaflex just to not get more messy than it needs to be.




Back to the front. We have to cut an armaflex gasket for the socket, and easy way to do it is to press the armaflex over the socket to get an imprint of the socket in the armaflex, then cut the hole.

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/f/f/ffae7e67.jpg

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/6/6/66211fa8.jpg




For those that took the IHS out of the proc, you can apply varnish, and dielectric grease around the core

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/4/c/4c054fba.jpg
http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/f/0/f0c4c0e1.jpg

I also used a piece of EVA rubber around the core as protection and insulation also.

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/e/c/ecfc2bb8.jpg


I know, my english sucks
Nothing makes me more mad than translations.
Whatever.

PD: Moderators can "fine tune" my ugly english.

[vapb400]

VERY nice guide!

and your english is fine :)

[Stigma]

Nice guide. Nice and through (like you should be when insulating).

Maybye tips on how how to get your hands on the materials would be good (especially neoprene and stuff like that can be hard to find).

-Stigma

[Ssilencer]

Thanks guys, I had never found neoprene in my country, so I always use armaflex, you can get it in any refrigeration store.

[vapb400]

where would one apply grease on the lga 775? on the bottom of the processor itself?

[quent]

Hi Ssilencer, nice guide :)

But, IMO the acrylic spray is not really needed and it break the motherboard's warranty..

[girth_maul]

Very clear guide! Sticky?

[DaBbLe]

I like it so much I'm about to use it :clap: :up:

[Metaxas]

HOORAY!

This guide is great, and your english is just fine, its gets the point across very well. :)

[Ssilencer]

Hi Ssilencer, nice guide :)

But, IMO the acrylic spray is not really needed and it break the motherboard's warranty..

Any of this mats can be removed with isopropil alcohol, just takes more time.
Thanks guys! I hope it helps

[hicookie]

:rofl: :rofl: did he really said anything?hahaha:D
that's funny, ur cat like a guru, check the insulation:rofl:

http://fotos.miarroba.com/fotos/8/9/89d759f7.jpg

[yngndrw]

Very nice guide, but can we have more pics of the inspector ? :P

There's something about overclockers having cats .... Hmmmm lol.

[SoF]

nice guide but for single stage users this is even too much insulation imo.
I only use armaflex without dielectric grease or any coating - works great, even 24/2 on week-ends.
But for long DICE or LN2 runs this insulation should do a great job with all the coating - think if I will take the next step in cooling I would go for exactly this kinda isolation :fact:

[[XC]melymel]

There's something about overclockers having cats .... Hmmmm lol.

That's what I noticed so I got 3 but it still hasn't helped my o'clock they just destroy hardware, maybe there bad steppings :confused: :p:

Nice thorough guide Ssilencer I shall be using this one, but would it be overkill for a chiller?, or can there not be overkill with insulation? :toast:

[Dumo]

Nice work there SSilencer:toast:

Heres mine with 775 boards and liquid tape....before cascade run, I don't want to take a change after 3 boards went kaput with possible condensation problem:(

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/2439/screenshot0037bf.jpg

I tied up rubber bands on those open pwms

http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/8526/screenshot2189nk2uu.jpg

[Ssilencer]

Really light insulations works perfect until you turn off your computer...
I'm more than happy with this one, I did it the same for a friend a year and a half ago, he turn or his pc every day for the nights, never had any problems.

Good one dumo, better overkill than hardware kill :)
Nice neoprene gasket, I hope I can get some of that some day.

I also got some liquid electrical tape from a friend in the states sometime ago, nasty stuff, but it is not that hard to get rid of it when needed.

[Kesnel]

Ssilencer, very nice guide. :toast:

What would you recommend for removing liquid electrical tape?

Dumo, do you think it would be possible to replace the liquid tape in your pictures with standard clear varnish?

[[XC] mysticmerlin]

very nice guide Ss

[Ssilencer]

Ssilencer, very nice guide. :toast:

What would you recommend for removing liquid electrical tape?

Your hands :) and some isopropil alcohol, looks like rubber when dry.


Dumo, do you think it would be possible to replace the liquid tape in your pictures with standard clear varnish?

I think so.

[vudoodoodoo]

Nice guide. Sticky?
Also I would like to know where to get the materials.

[[XC] mysticmerlin]

I vote sticky also

[Ssilencer]

Thanks, it is stiky now, thanks to Jinu

[Kesnel]

I can't seem to find pcb varnish with a brush applicator anywhere, all I can find is the spray.

Would regular nail varnish for around the socket do ok? Or could I use the spray on the front of the board too ensuring I masked off the socket and such?

[girth_maul]

@Mods- Please could we combine this thread and the other insulation threads into one?

[jinu117]

@Mods- Please could we combine this thread and the other insulation threads into one?

I respect each writers of guide. Unless the writers ask me to do so, I would rather not...

[girth_maul]

I respect each writers of guide. Unless the writers ask me to do so, I would rather not...

Cool, fair enough. I meant more of a thread pointing to each individual thread, sorry i was not clear. :)

[Ssilencer]

I can't seem to find pcb varnish with a brush applicator anywhere, all I can find is the spray.

Would regular nail varnish for around the socket do ok? Or could I use the spray on the front of the board too ensuring I masked off the socket and such?

If you ensure to mask every socket and such, sure.
You can use nail varnish or liquid electrical tape instead of varnish.

[tommo123]

just so i have this clear in my head:

spray the back of the mobo to seal it off and when needed put the grease to help avoid condensation (have heard this can be swapped for vaseline?)

on the top side of the mobo - put a thin layer of varnish (have to be careful tho as some are slightly conductive i think), then put a layer of grease/vaseline to help against condensation. then put neoprene in layers to seal off the socket and caps etc.

is that about right? dont want to screw this up and fry everything!

one thing tho, where does the seal string etc come to play?

[jabski]

just so i have this clear in my head:

spray the back of the mobo to seal it off and when needed put the grease to help avoid condensation (have heard this can be swapped for vaseline?)

on the top side of the mobo - put a thin layer of varnish (have to be careful tho as some are slightly conductive i think), then put a layer of grease/vaseline to help against condensation. then put neoprene in layers to seal off the socket and caps etc.

is that about right? dont want to screw this up and fry everything!

one thing tho, where does the seal string etc come to play?

Also where does the Artic Ceramique go ??:confused:

[tommo123]

the ceramique afaik, replaces artic sliver or whatever you normally use. iirc - it doesnt freeze as some of the others might at such low temps

[{.bLanK} GoD]

The seal string as most people call it, closest way to describe it is black blu tak.

http://xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=49844&stc=1&d=1154671750

A little overkill on the insulation, but considering its under the chiller atm and the board is lying flat, it's justified.
The conformal coating i sprayed onto my board (front and back) has a UV trace in it. :)

http://xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=49845&stc=1&d=1154672421

[afireinside]

I don't like messing with all the sticky foam and grease so I just sealed everything air tight. That's all that matters.

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/AM2/IMG_0741.JPG

1/2" neoprene around back plate held down by lexan (1/8th inche but 1/4th would be much better)

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/AM2/IMG_0744.JPG

Neoprene gasket around socket just like ssilencer showed

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/AM2/IMG_0776.JPG

Something to make an airtight seal between evap mount plate and gasket, and press down. I went with another, smaller gasket and a load of paper towels. A foam "donut" like this would work better but with a 3" cooler and this board I didn't have room.

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/insulation/IMG_0317.JPG

Nail polish also works very well and would be a good idea if you bench in high humidity. It comes off easily with some acetone, a few paper towels, and an old tooth brush. Or you can just leave it. I'm sick of dealing with dielectric grease and sticky foam tape, it's just to much of a pain to clean.

[SoF]

@afireinside easy, clean and not sticky - exactly the way I do it as well :toast: Nice pictures

[ryba]

This style of benching is better and more pro:cool:

http://rybamcz.boo.pl/zdjecia/fc/bez%20izolacji/PICT4959.JPG

...after a few hours running <-30


More photos (http://rybamcz.boo.pl/zdjecia/fc/bez%20izolacji/)

[Ssilencer]

I don't like messing with all the sticky foam and grease so I just sealed everything air tight. That's all that matters.

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/AM2/IMG_0741.JPG


So you put the bacl plate under the acrilic??? weird...
I think the other way is a lot better, because your seal is wider.

[4Qman]

Ssilencer,. :clap:

This is the best Condensation Proofing Guide ive read. Detailed pictures and sealed to the Max. Agree there is more lax ways to seal but this topic covers every aspect.

:toast:

[afireinside]

So you put the bacl plate under the acrilic??? weird...
I think the other way is a lot better, because your seal is wider.

Your way probably gives a better seal but
1: my back plate was held on with a sticky pad and a pain to remove
2: I just don't like the thought of having compressable foam between my mount and the mobo.

Either way works fine.

[{.bLanK} GoD]

@ryba
Your gonna blow that board up running it like that.
I see a lot of frost, and what happens to the frost when you turn the pc off?

[Brettbeck]

Has anyone ever tried 'Isoline' ? Is it similar to Armaflex or better/worse?

[ryba]

@ryba
Your gonna blow that board up running it like that.
I see a lot of frost, and what happens to the frost when you turn the pc off?

This worked 5-6h with no problems, next I put off evap. Mobo and cpu working correctly.

[Ssilencer]

Your way probably gives a better seal but
1: my back plate was held on with a sticky pad and a pain to remove
2: I just don't like the thought of having compressable foam between my mount and the mobo.

Either way works fine.

1_ oops didn't see that on the mobos I tested.
2_ well, I don't like having a piece of metal in contact with my mobo under cold, a little dangerous.

[{.bLanK} GoD]

This worked 5-6h with no problems, next I put off evap. Mobo and cpu working correctly.

I had condensation kill a board 4 days after it was first fired up, was started up and shutdown a few times. I thought i had a good air tight seal, but as it turns out :explode: lol. Dont say i didnt warn you.

[Saiyan[CHW]]

I have a question about this... I'm gonna use this to oc a slot1 P3, do i need to apply the spray anyway? (remember that slot1 is a "cassette" and it the tube wont be too close to the MB)

PD: I know, my english sucks too. xD

[Farwalker]

Ssilencer wrote:
". . an insulator that prevents the air passage, as armaflex or even better, neoprene."
and later also wrote:
"I also used a piece of EVA rubber around the core as protection and insulation also."

I see that you used armaflex and EVA rubber materials to insulate. What was the thickness of each material that you used?

I searched the internet to find a source of neoprene. materialscraps.com offers both 1/8 inch (3.175mm) and 1/4 inch (6.35mm) thickness sheets.
I have no experience with them. They appear to be located in the state of New York.

[exhausted mule]

bigfoot has some neoprene:

http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=10203

[Ssilencer]

Ssilencer wrote:
". . an insulator that prevents the air passage, as armaflex or even better, neoprene."
and later also wrote:
"I also used a piece of EVA rubber around the core as protection and insulation also."

I see that you used armaflex and EVA rubber materials to insulate. What was the thickness of each material that you used?

I searched the internet to find a source of neoprene. materialscraps.com offers both 1/8 inch (3.175mm) and 1/4 inch (6.35mm) thickness sheets.
I have no experience with them. They appear to be located in the state of New York.


In this guide, I used 10 or 13mm of armaflex.

Neoprene is much better imho, so maybe just 6.35mm can do the work, my problem is that I can't get neoprene in my country.

[MaSell]

Mobile cpu for s939? That is that?

[Cupcake]

Anyone know any local places I could pick up some neoprene or armaflex

Sears ?? Walmart ?? anywhere ??

[Nosfer@tu]

would love to try some liquid tape :)

[m411b]

This is handy!! Very nice and clear Ssilencer

[ziberia]

Just picked up some neoprene, 10mm and 2mm.

I remember seeing a drawing for the Vapo style 775 gasket, but can't find it.

Would anybody remember the link?

[[XC] gomeler]

Anyone know any local places I could pick up some neoprene or armaflex

Sears ?? Walmart ?? anywhere ??


The Home Depot and Lowes both carry full lines of armaflex, they'll be in the house insulation section. I have yet to source neoprene within Atlanta, if you find some let me know.

[epion2985]

I don't like messing with all the sticky foam and grease so I just sealed everything air tight. That's all that matters.

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/AM2/IMG_0741.JPG

1/2" neoprene around back plate held down by lexan (1/8th inche but 1/4th would be much better)

http://afireinside.evilspork.net/AFI/AM2/IMG_0744.JPG

Neoprene gasket around socket just like ssilencer showed


Something to make an airtight seal between evap mount plate and gasket, and press down. I went with another, smaller gasket and a load of paper towels. A foam "donut" like this would work better but with a 3" cooler and this board I didn't have room.



Nail polish also works very well and would be a good idea if you bench in high humidity. It comes off easily with some acetone, a few paper towels, and an old tooth brush. Or you can just leave it. I'm sick of dealing with dielectric grease and sticky foam tape, it's just to much of a pain to clean.




Thats not "air tight" by a long shot. First of you have air behind that acrylic plate in the middle. Second you have air inside your socket which will rust your pins off if not kill everything.

[boshuter]

Thats not "air tight" by a long shot. First of you have air behind that acrylic plate in the middle. Second you have air inside your socket which will rust your pins off if not kill everything.

There is nothing wrong with the way he has that socket insulated, as long as "outside" air doesn't get in there is no need for anything else. Look at "Kinpin's" DI/LN2 insulation guide and that is exactly how he does it for extended LN2 runs.

I'd be interested in seeing your insulation pics on your chiller cpu block, if you have a better system.

[epion2985]

There is nothing wrong with the way he has that socket insulated, as long as "outside" air doesn't get in there is no need for anything else.


Wrong. There is air in his socket, hence there is water in his socket that will condense. And that has been shown to do some serious damage.

Also there is air in the center of that plate, hence there is water, which will condense. Which is a problem unless he has sprayed his mobo back there with something.

Maybe he lives in a very low humidity climate, maybe his house is very dry, I don't know, but this type of neglect has been shown to do damage. Otherwise I wonder why the majority of people use dielectric compounds to fill the socket, must be just a trend right :rolleyes:

[johann]

Wrong. There is air in his socket, hence there is water in his socket that will condense. And that has been shown to do some serious damage.

Also there is air in the center of that plate, hence there is water, which will condense. Which is a problem unless he has sprayed his mobo back there with something.

Maybe he lives in a very low humidity climate, maybe his house is very dry, I don't know, but this type of neglect has been shown to do damage. Otherwise I wonder why the majority of people use dielectric compounds to fill the socket, must be just a trend right :rolleyes:

I agree, the gaps should be filled with Dieelectric grease

[Shagg]

first post on these forums and I will definately use this guide for my phase unit by the way nice forum.:)

[gosmeyer]

:welcome: Shagg
These guys IMO are the best around period
Very helpful and extremely knowledgeable.:yepp:

[Shagg]

Thanks I'm familiar with a few from pm's and another forum. Very nice information on this forum and will help me with my future build thanks for the welcome:up:

[one_servant]

Man, thanks a lot! I really appreciate you taking the time to get this together. I’m going to use it as my guide. I’d rather take the extra precautions you took and have too much protection than save myself a few minutes and/or a few dollars and have a fried motherboard. Thanks again.

[Ssilencer]

Thank you guys, nice to see people keeps getting good use of it :)

[one_servant]

This is just a bump to respectfully request this be stickied.

[Ssilencer]

It already is stickied, you have to check the stickies :)

[hecktic]

this is a great guide but I might just have 1 question though, its probably a stupid one because Im fairly new to the pre installation of phase change.

here goes...

Wont the varnish and other stuff you put on the motherboard but particularly the varnish cause issues with the board later down the road, like for example on the R50s on an evga 680i, if one was to smother them with conformal coating, dielectric grease and even so if the varnish was making contact with it as its near the socket on this board, then would this not cause problems especially when some users like to stick BGA sinks over the R50s to keep them cool... I imagine the TIM would react with the materials being used for insulation here?

Thanks in advance for your answer to my probably stupid question :(

[jimmyz]

this is a great guide but I might just have 1 question though, its probably a stupid one because Im fairly new to the pre installation of phase change.

here goes...

Wont the varnish and other stuff you put on the motherboard but particularly the varnish cause issues with the board later down the road, like for example on the R50s on an evga 680i, if one was to smother them with conformal coating, dielectric grease and even so if the varnish was making contact with it as its near the socket on this board, then would this not cause problems especially when some users like to stick BGA sinks over the R50s to keep them cool... I imagine the TIM would react with the materials being used for insulation here?

Thanks in advance for your answer to my probably stupid question :(



the power circuits tend to benefit from the cooling used since they are so close to the socket. for instance my dfi r600 board has a pwm sensor and temp hovers about 3c idle and only reaches about 12c when benching hard. even though they are buried in liquid electrical tape and armaflex.
anything within about 5cm of the socket seems to benifit from the phase cooling.

[BNDMOD]

How to clean dielectric grease from into LGA 775 socket?

Now a days people recommend me not to use grease for only benchs... only that i need, is to make a good insulation over board, and make sure than after every session keep out evap and cpu... to make sure that there isn`t condensation...